Will someone please shoot Desmond.

[Old Chuffer]

how to feel like a fish out of water. Send a newly dignosed T2 diabetic on a Desmond course where he will meet folk who look nothing like him, ie slim active and rather bewildered especialy when the nurse asks if he's wandered into the wrong clinic. Since then have met two others of similar build who also took one look at what was on offer and beat it. We do not need dietry advice we aren't obese we don't smoke or drink and are all pysically active. Might start a not a Desmond course for thin diabetics. PS All ex military.

 

[lucylocket61]

We do not need dietry advice

I agree that you dont need Desmond dietary advice, but the low carb advice on here will help your blood sugar levels.

 

[Guzzler]

I suggest that now you all know that you have Diabetes you are in need of dietary advice. Whether that advice should come from DESMOND is quite another matter.

 

[Deleted Account]

Unfortunately, I don't think it is a DESMOND problem or a type 2 problem.
When I was first diagnosed with type 1 diabetes, when I more recently went in a DAFNE type course, when I went on a pump (the only times I have met a dietician), most of the material is about losing weight. With a BMI of 21.5, I don't have a weight problem. If I lost weight I would have a problem.

I believe it is a society problem - with 62% of the UK adult population being overweight or obese, the material is generated for the majority.

 

[Rachox]

Hi and welcome Old Chuffer!
I see you are new to the Forum so I’ll tag in @daisy1 for her useful info post. Have a read of the dietary advice in her post, for Type 2 control it applies fat or thin.

 

[Flora123]

how to feel like a fish out of water. Send a newly dignosed T2 diabetic on a Desmond course where he will meet folk who look nothing like him, ie slim active and rather bewildered especialy when the nurse asks if he's wandered into the wrong clinic. Since then have met two others of similar build who also took one look at what was on offer and beat it. We do not need dietry advice we aren't obese we don't smoke or drink and are all pysically active. Might start a not a Desmond course for thin diabetics. PS All ex military.

I sound like you and didn’t even bother going!

 

[zand]

I am a bit concerned that you don't think you need dietary advice because you are slim. A slim person's diet can be worse than an obese person's diet.

 

[hankjam]

how to feel like a fish out of water. Send a newly dignosed T2 diabetic on a Desmond course where he will meet folk who look nothing like him, ie slim active and rather bewildered especialy when the nurse asks if he's wandered into the wrong clinic. Since then have met two others of similar build who also took one look at what was on offer and beat it. We do not need dietry advice we aren't obese we don't smoke or drink and are all pysically active. Might start a not a Desmond course for thin diabetics. PS All ex military.

A lot of don'ts though the T2 does need to be worked on and some of it will likely be diet.

 

[daisy1]

@Old Chuffer

Hello and welcome to the Forum Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask as many questions as you want and someone will help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. Most of these are free.

• Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why
  
  
• Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
  

 

[NicoleC1971]

Unfortunately, I don't think it is a DESMOND problem or a type 2 problem.
When I was first diagnosed with type 1 diabetes, when I more recently went in a DAFNE type course, when I went on a pump (the only times I have met a dietician), most of the material is about losing weight. With a BMI of 21.5, I don't have a weight problem. If I lost weight I would have a problem.

I believe it is a society problem - with 62% of the UK adult population being overweight or obese, the material is generated for the majority.

I'd agree that dieticians of the Dafne and Desmond ilk are obsessed with low fat and calories! The rather chubby dietician on the one I attended 2 weeks ago which was populated by non overweight type 1s was unable to deviate from the 'evidence based' low fat/high carb approach in which dosing correctly and eating low fat are the key messages. Yet only 17% of type 1 s hit the target HBA1c of 6.5% (this is a preview of the upcoming audit of diabetes treatment in the UK) so something is not working with that advice.
I totally agree that the OP by virtue of being diagnosed with type 2 needs to manage his carbohydrates regardless of this waistline because by definition he is not tolerating the amount he is eating now!
Don't want to shoot Des and Daphne because some people will improve their diet by attending but let's hope they can add low carb to the buffet.

 

[Pinkorchid]

Trouble is those courses are designed for the majority but we are all different and diet when we are already slim we have to tailor to suit us so as not to loose to much weight

 

[rosco 2]

One size just does not fit all, we know that and it’s pretty dreary when you find yourself doing something inappropriate (polite speak for a time wasting bunch of ****). Yesterday for the second time I have been given an appt with G.P. plus HCA. For a CHD / diabetes review. I don’t have CHD as far as I know. I have had no bloods since last appt in Sept...so what exactly are they going to review? Please bring your glucometer if you have one. You mean the one you refused to give me?? So, unsurprisingly I phoned to chancel yet again. At the risk of sounding arrogant, what exactly will an HCA contribute to my understanding given my previous profession? Ah! Tick box. Claim payment for seeing me in diabetes clinic. Giving up fags was my hard work, they missed out on that payment!

Edited by mod for profanity.

 

[Old Chuffer]

My cardiologist suggested a low carb diet ten years ago. I have folllowed his advice ever since as I have a conjenital heart condition and a propensity towards barely controlled high BP. My wife is a retired GP practice manager so was always upto date with the latest thinking. I just find the harping carping advice approach galling to the point of wanting to throw something at someone. I repeat I've done everthing right throughout my life yet still find myself with this unwanted albatross. I've been on statins for 20 years and am beginning to wonder what part they've played in my diagnosis

 

[zand]

My cardiologist suggested a low carb diet ten years ago. I have folllowed his advice ever since as I have a conjenital heart condition and a propensity towards barely controlled high BP. My wife is a retired GP practice manager so was always upto date with the latest thinking. I just find the harping carping advice approach galling to the point of wanting to throw something at someone. I repeat I've done everthing right throughout my life yet still find myself with this unwanted albatross. I've been on statins for 20 years and am beginning to wonder what part they've played in my diagnosis

just my opinion... but yes, I would say statins undoubtedly played a part in your diagnosis since they are known to increase your blood glucose levels. Did you take CoQ10 with them? You need that nutrient as statins deplete it and every cell in the body needs CoQ10.

Edit: Have a look at this thread
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/cholesterol-and-statins.156985/page-5#post-1918565

 

[hankjam]

My cardiologist suggested a low carb diet ten years ago. I have folllowed his advice ever since as I have a conjenital heart condition and a propensity towards barely controlled high BP. My wife is a retired GP practice manager so was always upto date with the latest thinking. I just find the harping carping advice approach galling to the point of wanting to throw something at someone. I repeat I've done everthing right throughout my life yet still find myself with this unwanted albatross. I've been on statins for 20 years and am beginning to wonder what part they've played in my diagnosis

My last visit with GP to talk about my high TC's and statin history was interesting in this point.
I've been on three statins, none of which agreed with my liver and so I came off them.... since then my TC's have increased year on year...
The current received wisdom is that statins don't interfere with liver function to any detrimental affect...

So I said to GP, no history of diabetes in my family at all on both sides of parents.... I think the statins triggered it and not happy to go back on them again.

He did not contradict me.

We left it there.

I suspect this sort of finding would have been selected out by the Oxford reviews for some poor reason but we will never know till it is available for other researchers to check.

I am now looking at my O 3:6 ratio.....

 

[KK123]

It's another example of those in authority thinking type 2 is simply to do with how much a person weighs. I am 57 and slim, I am convinced had I been large they would have written me off as type 2 with no qualms whatsoever. Instead because I didn't 'look' the part, they did the proper tests and lo and behold!

 

[librarising]

I am a bit concerned that you don't think you need dietary advice because you are slim. A slim person's diet can be worse than an obese person's diet.

Then add me to your 'concerned' list. I declined the offer of a Desmond course, as well as the offer of speaking to a dietitian. Unlike @Old Chuffer I didn't even make Day One, so had no experience to make my judgment on.
Some of us are capable of getting along in life largely without the aid of 'experts'. We prefer to self-educate, and I think I found this forum before the offers were made, so you can consider me well warned !
Geoff

 

[zand]

Then add me to your 'concerned' list. I declined the offer of a Desmond course, as well as the offer of speaking to a dietitian. Unlike @Old Chuffer I didn't even make Day One, so had no experience to make my judgment on.
Some of us are capable of getting along in life largely without the aid of 'experts'. We prefer to self-educate, and I think I found this forum before the offers were made, so you can consider me well warned !
Geoff

I'm with you on making our own choices for ourselves and self-educating. That's what I do too, I have never been offered a Desmond course and wouldn't accept the invitation if I was offered one. My comment was to do with the view that the OP expressed that if someone isn't fat then their diet is OK. My hubby isn't fat, but I can tell you his diet would not be any good at all if he were T2.

IMO opinion it's a shame the OP didn't self educate re statins too.

 

[librarising]

IMO opinion it's a shame the OP didn't self educate re statins too.

He was started on them 20 years ago. Totally different health environment. I may have taken them then
** shudders at the thought **
Geoff

p.s. He doesn't connect size with diet, but with feeling in the right place. He and others rejected "what was on offer".
I wonder if he's a Libra ?
Geoff

 

[rosco 2]

Formulaic health care, ditto social care is a potential nightmare. GP care (remember GPs are not NHS employees) is heavily incentivised because GPs threatened to take their skills elsewhere if they didn’t ge5 more money. There are no poor GPs. Thus they get paid additional sums for providing various services. Often they just hired cheap labour (hca) and pocketed the profits. As a former nurse, I was paid to do my job. If you needed blood pressure readings, bloods taken, letters written, whatever, I just did it. Cost you (the taxpayer) not a bean more.