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Low Carb Diabetes Site in Trouble.

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bulkbiker said:
Really?
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We are all different. Many years ago I tried the Atkins (no carb) and I just felt rough. If my wife doesn't eat carbs she falls over in a faint and in fact the same goes for an old mate of mine who goes weak and wobbly without carbs. We are all so very different.
 
Im another exception - I manage my diabetes very well on 35-50g carbs.But hit major problems if I go below 20ishg carbs - my sugars start to rise, getting into double figures if I go beyond few ( 4 or 5) days at that level and I start to feel like ***** - my ketones also go well beyond the nutritional ketosis level, hitting 7s the last time I tried to go keto.
As DavidGrahamjones points out, we are all so very different
 
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bulkbiker said:
Sorry but you have just advised us.. incorrectly in my opinion... to eliminate saturated fats or we might have a heart attack or stroke. We are all here to share our experiences.. as you are doing with your Newcastle Diet posts. I'm not sure I can see the difference to be honest.
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I was simply giving an example of a common co-morbidity. Even if medically qualified it would be difficult to give accurate advice without knowing what other conditions the patient had. Old ladies of 83 like this one tend to have a number of co-morbidities. Dieticians prescribe diets taking into account all the conditions a patient has, not just one of them. As to ND I am hoping it will work for me but by no means sure. I am trying it because I have nothing to lose even if it doesn't work.
 
Tannith said:
As to ND I am hoping it will work for me but by no means sure.
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I managed 6 weeks, I didn't expect a cure, maybe if I lose substantial amounts of eight rather than just a few kgs. However, it did a wonderful job of straightening out my BG at a sensible level (5 -7), rather than the peaks and troughs I was getting, even with 40gms carb a day (all vegetable).

It also showed me that with a Resting Metabolic Rate of 2400 calories per day, I don't lose any weight until I get down to about 800 calories a day, despite what dieticians say. The only good thing about trying 1800 then 1500 then 1200 without success was that it was only a small drop to 800 achieved by taking out all meat and fish.

It should work for you, but I realise that (stating the obvious), we're all different.
 
DavidGrahamJones said:
I managed 6 weeks, I didn't expect a cure, maybe if I lose substantial amounts of eight rather than just a few kgs. However, it did a wonderful job of straightening out my BG at a sensible level (5 -7), rather than the peaks and troughs I was getting, even with 40gms carb a day (all vegetable).

It also showed me that with a Resting Metabolic Rate of 2400 calories per day, I don't lose any weight until I get down to about 800 calories a day, despite what dieticians say. The only good thing about trying 1800 then 1500 then 1200 without success was that it was only a small drop to 800 achieved by taking out all meat and fish.

It should work for you, but I realise that (stating the obvious), we're all different.
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I'm in my 15th week, but I am doing the coward's version, 900 to1000 cal. I am losing weight steadily but very slowly. My BGs came down with quite a jump at first but have now levelled off around the lower end of prediabetic level.I shall need to do another 6 weeks or so to lose 15% of my original weight. I would certainly not recommed ND to any little old ladies. My diet is low in both carbs and fat.Like your wife and friend I go faint and wobbly when my blood sugar drops, and old ladies are prone to falls anyway. Plus when they do have falls they are more prone to break bones than when they were younger.
 
Tannith said:
Even if medically qualified it would be difficult to give accurate advice without knowing what other conditions the patient had
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I agree we really should know more about someone before they are recommended the low carb higher fat diet especially older people because chances are they could have other medical conditions that may not make it suitable for them.
 
Bluetit1802 said:
Quite a lot I would imagine, or at the very least needing insulin to control matters.
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Maybe so but saying they will die is not something I think should be said on here without any evidence.
 
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Just to remind people, the elderly woman was advised to cut out carbs by a gentleman at a stand at the Eistedfod. A stand put up by an individual not linked to this site or any other site of repute.
Her family reported illness (stomach pains) after taking the advice but the key point was that a reputable site with a similar name had received complaints.
This was poor reporting and I can only guess that it was a very slow news day at the Beeb. In my opinion there was a lack of detail. To blame a diet for what happened to the woman when we neither know the full details of the advice given or the nature of the extent of her illness is jumping to the wrong conclusions.
 
ringi said:
Remember that Type2 reduces someone life expectancy by about 10 years, unless it is reversed by diet…...
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Huh? The figure includes all Type 2s, including those who are not controlling their BG adequately, or at all.

Control can come with diet, diet plus drugs, insulin ... what matters is getting the control. Anyone who has consistent control will, on average, beat those odds and not have their life shortened by as much as 10 years.

Am I missing something?

(Perhaps you have stats showing that diet-only has a better prognosis than all the other options? If so where are they? I didn't know they were available in that kind of detail.)

There are all sorts of other reasons to try diet-only if you can. That's another story.
 
Grateful said:
Huh? The figure includes all Type 2s, including those who are not controlling their BG adequately, or at all.

Control can come with diet, diet plus drugs, insulin ... what matters is getting the control. Anyone who has consistent control will, on average, beat those odds and not have their life shortened by 10 years.

Am I missing something?

(Perhaps you have stats showing that diet-only has a better prognosis than all the other options? If so where are they?)
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snap - posted at the same time :)
 
Boo1979 said:
Not quite a simple as that - combinations of risk factors give different indications - smoking status, hba1c, systolic bp, cholesterol among others
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click on image to zoom&p=PMC3&id=2663724_ehn56701.jpg
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That's a fantastic table, thanks. I am amazed at the difference BP makes though.

I wish they would also have a scenario for people with HbA1c squarely in the "normal" (non-diabetic and non-pre-diabetic) range but perhaps they found this did not make much difference? The lowest case they present is HbA1c of 6% (42).
 
One thought.

The stats may not exist, but common sense suggests that diet-only life expectancies might be a bit better than the other control options simply because (1) insulin for instance has its own risks in terms of "accidents," and (2) it may be that drugs or insulin are by definition being used by people with "more severe" T2 cases.

But as far as I know, it doesn't matter that much, as long as you have consistent control. Control is much more important than the other factors.
 
Hi All,

just to let you know that a post on this thread has been deleted because it advised members to give medical advice.

In case you were unaware, it is against the forum ethos and rules (see link in my signature) for any member to give medical advice on the forum.

We can, however, offer support and speak from personal experience. We can also offer facts and scientific information, where possible backed by references. The more accurate the information, and the more evidence we can provide, the better we help each other to handle our health.
 
Reply to grateful
Thats certainly my hope ( and belief) Ive been on meds for all of the 20 plus years since diagnosis but keep hba1c in the 40s by a combination of diet, medsand exercise - meds have been stable all the way through since I strted on glic a few months in (initially on insulin) - same meds, same dose - stopping meds doesnt work
 
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Grateful said:
(1) insulin for instance has its own risks in terms of "accidents,"
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Hope you don't mind me popping in a T1 perspective on this, @Grateful , but seeing as both T1 and T2s use insulin, there might be a place for it.

I've certainly had a few major accidents with insulin, although, to be honest, they were mainly in my younger years, when I'd hit the town till 3am during the Edinburgh festival, and, well, lets just say, there was a bit of drinking involved.

Anyway, that excuse aside, we seem to be going through a transitional stage at the moment. Cgm/libre has been discussed a lot recently for obvious reasons. There's a lot of politics involved, no-one is placing any bets on their ccg approving it any time soon, but I'm quietly confident that things will get to a stage at some point in the near future where it'll be obvious to docs that cgm improves quality of life so much for insulin users that we'll be wondering why there was any fuss over prescribing them.

For anyone on insulin who hasn't used cgm yet, you get a little snapshot with strips, whereas with cgm, you're seeing the whole 24 hour movie, so you can see when a hypo accident is looming and take steps to avoid it.

At the moment, docs/politicians just say, oh, I just need to see your hba1c. Yeah, fine for you doc, but it doesn't help me a lot the other 365 days of the year when I'm regularly injecting a substance which both lets me live and, if I get it wrong, might put me on the floor. Cgm makes that job much easier, and I think that gentle persuasion will get us to a point where it'll be a standard prescription, in much the same way that colour changing strips were regarded as cutting edge, and then were embarrasingly old fashioned when meters came out. We're all part of a point in history here, people!
 
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