Weight Watcher getting crushed by Keto

[Brunneria]

Very true point.. although to be fair to LC and keto (DD and Fung/Bernstein) they seem to not have the "repeat business model". They advocate a lifetime change not a short term intervention. They also give a lot more away for free than SW and WW (although maybe only for the moment).

Yes, WW and SW et al. may suddenly burst out in charitable sponsorship and research funding, to try and raise their public images.

 

[Guzzler]

All businesses are intended to make money.
I’ve seen plenty of posts on this forum criticising DietDoctor for having content behind a paywall, for Jason Fung and Bernstein for promoting books, for Atkins selling bars and shakes, for Virta charging for services and for Prolon being expensive.

Some of those organisations donate money to research. Some don’t. But they exist because people pay them.

Don’t get me wrong - I’m a low carber for health reasons. Probably will be for life.
But I don’t see the point of criticising WW or SW for being money earners, while claiming that LC and Keto organisations are somehow better - when they are open to the same criticism.

(Of course both slimming club diets and keto diets can be achieved with unprocessed and unbranded foods too, for those who choose to do it)

The reality is that people struggle to maintain any change to their way of eating, and backslide regularly.
And even keto can be a Frankenfood diet of processed shakes, bars and chemicals.

I agree with you I just do not remember hearing of a Keto business model that is c40 years old and is making some people a lorra dosh. It will happen, no doubt unless, as you say, peoples mindsets about the whole concept of diet is changed.

 

[bulkbiker]

Yes, WW and SW et al. may suddenly burst out in charitable sponsorship and research funding, to try and raise their public images.

Might not have quite the results they want though...?

 

[Member496333]

I have no problem with people making money. I do have a problem with people making money by making other people sick. That’s not necessarily aimed at Weight Watchers. Just a comment on the broader topic of profit-making enterprises in this space. If Jason Fung released another book tomorrow I would buy it on sight even if I had no intention of reading it. Mainly because the guy saved my life

 

[bulkbiker]

I have no problem with people making money. I do have a problem with people making money by making other people sick. That’s not necessarily aimed at Weight Watchers. Just a comment on the broader topic of profit-making enterprises in this space. If Jason Fung released another book tomorrow I would buy it on sight even if I had no intention of reading it. Mainly because the guy saved my life

He just has.... not sure I like the sound of it though.. "The Longevity Solution"

 

[Member496333]

He just has.... not sure I like the sound of it though.. "The Longevity Solution"

Wow. I just checked Apple Books as well, and didn’t see it. I will watch this space. Thanks!

 

[bulkbiker]

Wow. I just checked Apple Books as well, and didn’t see it. I will watch this space. Thanks!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Longevity-...UTF8&qid=1551447774&sr=8-3&keywords=longevity
Available mid march here... out in the states already I think.. I hear it has things like "eat less meat in it"... such heresy.. but maybe DiNicolantonio wrote that bit..

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

If you seriously think they are expert in weight loss then I'm sorry but you have been seriously misled.

I didn't think I said they were expert because that they are not. One thing they do instill is discipline because we can't ALL eat exactly what we want, unlike some forum members who seem to be able to just watch out for carbs. Just out of interest I wonder how many people reading this have looked into weight watchers? They definitely have interesting recipe ideas. I'm not advocating them but I'm not putting them down either, must be my star sign . . . . . Gemini.

 

[Krystyna23040]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Longevity-...UTF8&qid=1551447774&sr=8-3&keywords=longevity
Available mid march here... out in the states already I think.. I hear it has things like "eat less meat in it"... such heresy.. but maybe DiNicolantonio wrote that bit..

Have just downloaded the kindle edition from Amazon \- so thank you for the link. Unfortunately am just off to work so won't be able to read it until later.

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

I am no bioengineer but it took just one test to see that white bread wasn't the best thing in the kitchen if weight loss was a goal nor better bg management.

I understand completely when it comes to BG, but can your really tell in one test whether white bread is worse than other varieties when it comes to weight loss? It's easy to forget that we're a clever bunch on this forum, we don't need anyone to tell us how to lose weight, we already know (in my dreams). There are some people who really don't have a clue and if you've ever spoken to some hospital dieticians who haven't worked out that you're not stupid and speak to you in a most annoyingly condescending manner, like none of us have a clue, then you'll know what I mean.

I asked her indoors why she sticks to Weight Watchers, especially as weight loss isn't happening this time round (she has or had free membership because she lost weight and then managed to keep the weight off . . . . until she stopped thinking about how much she ate and what she ate.

She reminded me that she likes the recipes, she likes the meetings which act as an incentive, she also likes the social aspect of the meetings and the "talks" that they receive. I also think she's hooked on the low calorie chocolate bars, essential if you have a sweet tooth.

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

Yes, WW and SW et al. may suddenly burst out in charitable sponsorship and research funding

They are currently recruiting for data analysts and researchers to join their existing team in New York.

 

[Guzzler]

I understand completely when it comes to BG, but can your really tell in one test whether white bread is worse than other varieties when it comes to weight loss? It's easy to forget that we're a clever bunch on this forum, we don't need anyone to tell us how to lose weight, we already know (in my dreams). There are some people who really don't have a clue and if you've ever spoken to some hospital dieticians who haven't worked out that you're not stupid and speak to you in a most annoyingly condescending manner, like none of us have a clue, then you'll know what I mean.

I asked her indoors why she sticks to Weight Watchers, especially as weight loss isn't happening this time round (she has or had free membership because she lost weight and then managed to keep the weight off . . . . until she stopped thinking about how much she ate and what she ate.

She reminded me that she likes the recipes, she likes the meetings which act as an incentive, she also likes the social aspect of the meetings and the "talks" that they receive. I also think she's hooked on the low calorie chocolate bars, essential if you have a sweet tooth.

That suggests that a Low Carb kind of programme would/might work for some people, y'know, somewhere where people could meet up and and learn and discuss and socialise? I know of one place, it would be great if it was IRL.

 

[JohnEGreen]

Many years ago a friend of mine wanted to go to weight watchers but did not want to go by himself fearing he would me the only bloke there so I joined up with him and we went to meatings and weigh ins regularly I lost about a stone was not particularly overweight to start with he lost over seven stone and kept it off for some time though putting weight back on since he has never reached the weight he was before going.

I under stand quite well why people persist with WW it is far more than just getting weighed every week there is mutual support within the groups.

There are I think many paths to a destination some take one others another.

 

[derry60]

Oprah has struggled with her weight for a very long time, yoyo-ing over the years. Proof positive that restricting calories only (even when you're rich enough to employ a resident chef and a personal trainer) does not work for the majority of people in the long term.

This article leads me to wonder whether Oprah will now come out all guns blazing against Keto in order to protect her investment. While I feel sorry for the layperson whose job relies on WW (manufacturing as well as group leaders) I can't say I would be sad to see WW bite the dust.

I would love to see W/W bite the dust to be honest. I used to eat their yoghurts, and eat some of their ready meals, their cheese, and anything else that they promoted as healthy. I did not have many of their ready meals as I love to cook and loved my grains etc (That did not help me either) W/W's sell many different products promoting health benefits. I gained weight never lost. I even bought their bacon back in the day. All contained high amounts of sugar and still do. I did not know that at the time. I trusted them. If you look at one of their deserts, one small pot contains 16 grams of sugar. I really believe that it was the carbs and sugar that put me onto the path of pre-diabetes. Slimming world can go as well as far as I am concerned.

 

[jjraak]

I lost a lot of weight with weight watchers in mid 70s. back then it was a very controlled diet no calorie counting, low carb, lowish fat but quite decent portions of protein. I found it easy to stick to although very rigid for eating out. WW is nothing like it was when it was originally conceived

I wonder if that would be age..?

i have seen a graph showing the decline in glucose management in the body v the rise of insulin.
(seen in one of the videos kindly pointed out to me ) where the two metrics dip and rise respectively as we age, and then BAM
they cross over and THAT'S when we head into type 2 and insulin resistance territory..(i'm guessing the IR was the Glucose management line)

Here's a thought re WW/SW

If we all on here are SO smart to figure out that LCHF COULD be of benefit in losing weight, as testified by SO many.

Seems odd that weight watchers/slimming world..couldn't have spotted that as well, and adapted what THEY sell.?

Sure there's a good reason....Business wise..

but i can't think of ONE that would be a good reason to withhold something that MAY be beneficial to there CORE clients, unless the business model requires an element of failure and returning customers...?

as someone who has never dieted, until DX when i had to, i sympathies with those who need the help,

my point is... is that really HELP, when it seems more of a snake oil salesman technique..(come buy my elixir of skinny, guaranteed results ) selling something that MUST know does NOT work in the LONG term.??

No axe to grind, happy for others to carry one using whatever they find works for them in whatever way.
and i genuinely hope they find it useful..
i'm just musing out loud.

Only reason i am here is Because of the T2D..
otherwise i'd be struggling i guess, with my weight and following all the bad advice we get given.

i just hate to see people taken for fools..to line someone's else's pocket.


Me ? ...i'm happy here in LCHF world

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

it would be great if it was IRL.

That would be good, I spent a year working for the Central Bank, I loved it, shame I had to go home. My wife, the WW fan has just applied for Irish citizenship. Keep eyes open for a new post ref: low carb and the government.

 

[Ponchu]

I have no problem with people making money. I do have a problem with people making money by making other people sick. That’s not necessarily aimed at Weight Watchers. Just a comment on the broader topic of profit-making enterprises in this space. If Jason Fung released another book tomorrow I would buy it on sight even if I had no intention of reading it. Mainly because the guy saved my life

Food Industry
Pharma industry
Health Care industry
Diet Industry
Regulatory job security
American Diabetes Association
American Heart Association

...the list goes on of those who contributed to human suffering while profiteering on it.

Even some charity organizations that beg for donations for cancer research, using emotional manipulation, have had top docs - executives sitting on Pharma boards getting wealthy.

 

[Guzzler]

That would be good, I spent a year working for the Central Bank, I loved it, shame I had to go home. My wife, the WW fan has just applied for Irish citizenship. Keep eyes open for a new post ref: low carb and the government.

Apologies, not sure I understand. My IRL is short for 'In Real Life'.

 

[Krystyna23040]

Seems odd that weight watchers/slimming world..couldn't have spotted that as well, and adapted what THEY sell.?

Sure there's a good reason....Business wise..

but i can't think of ONE that would be a good reason to withhold something that MAY be beneficial to there CORE clients, unless the business model requires an element of failure and returning customers...?

I think that you are absolutely right. A good business model will be to keep the customers coming back over and over again.

 

[Gardengnome]

I wasted over 40 years [and £££] as a weight watcher and it was only 6 years ago that I finally had the scales lifted from my eyes when a month into yet another WW return I turned up to a class and a dim witted clerk was reading a trashy magazine and taking the money, all the time with a hand in a packet of crisps. They were Weight Watcher crisps so that was OK. Shortly after that there was a TV programme exposing various diets and WW came off badly with all the low fat and high carb nonsense. I bought Michael Moseley's book on Fast Dieting and the weight dropped off, I didn't have that much to lose. What's more 6 years on and it has never returned and although I'm fairly careful I do not diet nor do I touch low fat anything. Sadly though I eat more carbs than I should and my HbA1c is too high. Not yet diabetic but I seem unable to wean myself off fruit, a legacy of over 40 years of weight watching.
In fact all I did over those 40 years was watch my weight yo-yo. I lost stones with WW but always the same ones.