Another Food Industry Attack on Keto

Winnie53

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A friend who is obese and recently diagnosed with diabetes commented yesterday that there is push back against the ketogenic diet by doctors who say the diet is dangerous. I didn't anticipate this. My bad. I responded as best I could.

Then last night I come across this on a website based out of New York City, The Daily Meal - All Things Food & Drink...

‘Keto Rash’ Is the Horrifying New Side Effect of Eating Low-Carb
July 19, 2019 | 12:16pm

Holly Van Hare
The rash can literally scar you for life

Here's the link... https://www.thedailymeal.com/healthy-eating/keto-rash-side-effect-low-carb/071919

After reading the last two paragraphs...

"The condition is called prurigo pigmentosa. Existing scientific literature shows a link between ketosis and the rash, though studies show other intervening factors (such as sunlight, extreme heat, allergens and sweating) may worsen the condition. Going on the keto diet is not the only way humans can enter ketosis. Conditions such as diabetes mellitus and anorexia nervosa can also lead to this state, as well as fasting and dieting.

A 2018 case study showed that prurigo pigmentosa can only really be treated by eating a lot more carbs — i.e., quitting keto. Other options, such as topical creams and anti-inflammatory drugs, may temporarily relieve symptoms — but if you don’t quit the diet, the rash is likely to return in full force once you stop using them. “There is no dietary treatment option to successfully treat the rash without sacrificing ketosis,” the study reads. And once the rash disappears, there is no known method of getting rid of the dark brown spots prurigo pigmentosa leaves behind."


I asked the question, "What is "prurigo pigmentosa"? This was my first search result...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5945928/

From the abstract:

"Prurigo pigmentosa is a rare inflammatory dermatitis first described in 1971. While the etiology of Prurigo pigmentosa is yet unknown, conditions associated with ketosis often accompany this rash. Prurigo pigmentosa is successfully treated with antibiotics and by resolution of ketosis. However, there is no dietary treatment option to successfully treat the rash without sacrificing ketosis. We report two cases successfully treated with increase of dietary carbohydrate intake. The second case suggests that cessation of ketosis may not be necessary to resolve Prurigo pigmentosa.

Keywords: Ketogenic Diet, Prurigo Pigmentosa, Epilepsy"

From the first paragraph of the Introduction...

"Prurigo pigmentosa (PP) is considered a rare inflammatory dermatitis first described by Nagashima, et al, in 1971.1 It typically occurs in Asian women of child-bearing age but has also been documented in individuals in other regions and ethnicities, as well as in men.29 Certain systemic conditions, including adult—onset Still's disease,10 atopy,11H. pylori infection,12 and Sjögren's syndrome13 have been associated with PP. It has also been strongly associated with conditions that commonly produce ketosis, such as restrictive dieting, fasting, and uncontrolled diabetes mellitus.2,1418 Nutrition—related PP has not been reported in the pre-pubescent population.2 It is rarely reported in the United States, although this may be due to the unfamiliarity of practitioners with this condition.7"

Interestingly, the journalist failed to report that the doctors who wrote the above above article - (click on the second link) - state in the Discussion section...

"To our knowledge, we are the first to demonstrate that complete resolution of ketosis may not be necessary to successfully treat the rash, which is of particular importance in cases where the KD is therapeutically valuable as a successful treatment modality for medical conditions."

Learning about the ketogenic diet as a means to put my diabetes in remission was an exciting and life changing moment for me in 2015. Starting was easy, but staying on it those first few months was scary because it went against everything I'd been taught about diet up until that point. Don't know how I could have continued had it not been for the support of forum members here who provided me link after link to the research that support this way of eating.

Thankfully, the doctors are slowly coming on board, as are some in the food industry. Our local food co-op prepares and offers a variety of healthy, organic, "keto" foods on their hot bar and from their bakery daily. And just the other day I passed a local coffee house advertising "keto coffee drinks". It's a slow slog but we're making progress despite those who want to maintain the status quo of diets that include unhealthy, processed starches, sugars, and seed oils...that are slowly killing us.
 
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Winnie53

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Guzzler

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I am trying to find the refutations for Keto Rash (did not save them at the time) but they were on a par with the replies that Keto Crotch got. Will keep looking.
 

Winnie53

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Thanks Guzzler. I found another article attacking the ketogenic diet written by her for the same website in April...

Hidden Dangers of the Keto Diet

April 15, 2019

Holly Van Hare
There’s a dark side to this diet you might not know about

https://www.thedailymeal.com/healthy-eating/hidden-dangers-keto-diet

I wasn't aware that "keto rash" had already been reported.

In her April article she's using the same reporting tactics. Now I'm curious as to whether she's the only writer for this website. I'm still exploring the website.
 
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HSSS

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I am trying to find the refutations for Keto Rash (did not save them at the time) but they were on a par with the replies that Keto Crotch got. Will keep looking.
I’m interested in whatever you find. I have a recurring similar rash in a small area on my chest for the last 10 months currently unresponsive to all other treatment with no apparent cause and awaiting dermatologist opinion for the second time. Whilst I am highly suspicious of the anti keto agenda it’s worth considering I guess.
 

Winnie53

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So far, every article I've clicked on is by her. It appears to be a blog that is actively soliciting advertisers. I assume she's writing some articles on controversial topics to draw traffic to her website. Some of the articles are informative, some appear to be promoting processed foods.

In this blog post, she's reporting on intermittent fasting...

Intermittent Fasting Could Raise Your Risk of Diabetes, New Research Says
May 30, 2018
Holly Van Hare
This diet might not be right for everyone

The article is based primarily on the results of a rat study. Here are excerpts...

Ana Bonassa and a team of researchers from the University of Sao Paulo in Brazil investigated the effects of fasting diets on a group of rats, keeping close tabs on body weight, levels of damaging free radicals, and insulin function over three months. Fasting diets, often called intermittent fasting, involve temporary intervals of reduced eating followed by intervals of eating more regularly."

The researchers noticed that the diets weren’t working. Although the rats were eating less and losing weight overall, the amount of fat tissue around their abdomens grew larger. Their pancreases, which are in charge of releasing insulin, also showed damage that pointed to growing insulin resistance. Insulin resistance is the driving factor behind many cases of Type 2 diabetes.

Citing these observations, Bonassa cautioned against recommending fasting diets to those who are considered overweight or obese. This portion of the population, Bonassa said to Science Daily, may already experience insulin resistance.


“Although this diet may lead to early, rapid weight loss,” Bonassa explained, “in the long-term there could be potentially serious damaging effects to their health, such as the development of Type 2 diabetes.”

Of course, Bonassa’s team didn’t determine exactly how the diet brought about these effects, and more research is needed; there’s likely much more we don’t already know about the relationship between diabetes and diet.
 
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Winnie53

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I’m interested in whatever you find. I have a recurring similar rash in a small area on my chest for the last 10 months currently unresponsive to all other treatment with no apparent cause and awaiting dermatologist opinion for the second time. Whilst I am highly suspicious of the anti keto agenda it’s worth considering I guess.

HSSS sorry to hear you have a rash. That's not good. The 2018 article I posted above may be of interest to you...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5945928/

You might also benefit from doing additional searches. Do let us know what you learn.

[Edited to add]: After reading the Diet Doctor article and the first few comments, I found it so encouraging to learn that there are many alternatives to try first before resorting to antibiotics to heal the rash.
 
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Winnie53

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Winnie53

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From post 206 by "Becky H"...

I am sorry to hear that people have had to stop the diet because of this rash.
I have gotten this every time I went into ketosis, until I figured out what was causing it.
From researching, I have learned that bile is absorbed from the end of the small intestine and recycled in the liver to use again. The problem comes when this happens too much.
Since bile is also used to carry some types of bodily wastes out of the body, if it keeps getting recycled, then the wastes just get concentrated.
Soluble fiber binds to bile and takes it out of the body. Then the liver makes new bile.

Once I started taking soluble fiber, the rash stopped. I haven't had problems since. I use psyllium husk. But other forms are aloe vera, carrageenan, xantham gum, chicory root, etc... and it occurs in some veggies too.
I hope this helps someone.

This is so interesting. From the first day of the ketogenic diet, I ate as much fiber as I could from vegetables and raw nuts with every meal. Still do. But then, who knows. The condition appears to be rare, so perhaps I was just lucky.

What's also interesting is that pediatric endocrinologist Robert Lustig, MD, who worked with patients at UCSF for 17 years used the ketogenic diet with some his young obese patients. In a few recent interviews, he has emphasized the importance of "protect the liver, feed the gut". What he means is to remove fructose and other added sugars found in processed foods from the diet, and to eat real, whole foods to feed the microbes in our gut. He's concerned that the low carb/keto communities are not doing enough to promote eating, real whole foods.
 
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AloeSvea

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The opening sentence says it all: "Keto flu, keto breath, keto crotch… What’s next? Unfortunately, new side effects of the keto diet continue to emerge."

Words such 'Painful' 'extremely' 'worst' 'insanely' 'horrific' 'serious side effects' 'Dangerous' and 'horrifying' in the title. And the horrifyingly common confusion between ketoacidosis and ketosis, I assume - "Going on the keto diet is not the only way humans can enter ketosis. Conditions such as diabetes mellitus and anorexia nervosa can also lead to this state, as well as fasting and dieting."

Holly Van Hare, the Daily Meal journalist, gives journalism a bad name in this piece.
 
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HSSS

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Thanks. I’m heading to bed in a minute but I’ve marked those studies to be read with open eyes in the morning. Mine may be nothing to do with keto but it’s flipping annoying so worth trying some of the ideas. Soluble fibre eg psyllium sounds easy enough.
 
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AloeSvea

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OK, now I'm getting mighty p.o.-ed with Holly Van Hare. (I hope it's OK to focus on the source a little here a bit more rather than the rash? Although understood this thread is essentially about the rash being associated with keto...)

From @Winnie53 's excellent posting above, quoting Van Hare, this time on periods of not eating: "Citing these observations, Bonassa cautioned against recommending fasting diets to those who are considered overweight or obese. This portion of the population, Bonassa said to Science Daily, may already experience insulin resistance.

“Although this diet may lead to early, rapid weight loss,” Bonassa explained, “in the long-term there could be potentially serious damaging effects to their health, such as the development of Type 2 diabetes.”

Of course, Bonassa’s team didn’t determine exactly how the diet brought about these effects, and more research is needed; there’s likely much more we don’t already know about the relationship between diabetes and diet."

Periods of not eating, and low-carb eating leading to human insulin resistance? Especially for those who already have significant insulin resistance/with type two diabetes?

We don't already know the relationship between type two/insulin resistance and excess carbs? Also what is called 'calorific excess' ?(although I don't like that phrase, and prefer to use 'excess energy from food' - a polite way to say excess carbs in a bad-fats environment imho).

Oh yes we do. We sure do.

I would like to have brunch with Holly Van Hare. (In NYC? Oh yes please. I wonder if I could claim the airplane ticket on my taxes...) I would like to talk to her about the severe insulin resistance I got from eating excess carbs and bad for us oils, after being told to in the 1970s on, apparently for my health, that messed up my metabolism and wrecked my liver and pancreas so my life expectancy is lowered by 10 years, at least according to my life insurers. (Yeah, I can get expressive about the wrecked health from food thing. More of us should, I believe.) (I won't even go into body fat storage, ie obesity.) How low carbs and fasting is the best way to try and get some years back, hopefully healthier liver function, but that this may not happen.

This type of info on the internet makes the job of the 'diet and exercise against insulin resistance' communicators (which I consider myself one) soooooo much harder. And the price is many more people's good health - it's not like we are discussing an interesting philosophical difference here. This is people's lives, limbs, kidneys - well you all know the story.
 
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Winnie53

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The opening sentence says it all: "Keto flu, keto breath, keto crotch… What’s next? Unfortunately, new side effects of the keto diet continue to emerge."

Words such 'Painful' 'extremely' 'worst' 'insanely' 'horrific' 'serious side effects' 'Dangerous' and 'horrifying' in the title. And the horrifyingly common confusion between ketoacidosis and ketosis, I assume - "Going on the keto diet is not the only way humans can enter ketosis. Conditions such as diabetes mellitus and anorexia nervosa can also lead to this state, as well as fasting and dieting."

Holly Van Hare, the Daily Meal journalist, gives journalism a bad name in this piece.

Thank you AloeSvea for putting into words what I felt.

Thank goodness for Diet Doctor. They brought attention to the problem in 2016 and provided many things to try.
 

Resurgam

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I add a small amount of psyllium flour or husk - it depends what I have on the shelf at the time, to the coleslaw I have in my salads - I found that trying to drink it just pebble dashed the inside of the glass.
 

Winnie53

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OK, now I'm getting mighty p.o.-ed with Holly Van Hare. (I hope it's OK to focus on the source a little here a bit more rather than the rash? Although understood this thread is essentially about the rash being associated with keto...)

From @Winnie53 's excellent posting above, quoting Van Hare, this time on periods of not eating: "Citing these observations, Bonassa cautioned against recommending fasting diets to those who are considered overweight or obese. This portion of the population, Bonassa said to Science Daily, may already experience insulin resistance.

“Although this diet may lead to early, rapid weight loss,” Bonassa explained, “in the long-term there could be potentially serious damaging effects to their health, such as the development of Type 2 diabetes.”

Of course, Bonassa’s team didn’t determine exactly how the diet brought about these effects, and more research is needed; there’s likely much more we don’t already know about the relationship between diabetes and diet."

Periods of not eating, and low-carb eating leading to human insulin resistance? Especially for those who already have significant insulin resistance/with type two diabetes?

We don't already know the relationship between type two/insulin resistance and excess carbs? Also what is called 'calorific excess' ?(although I don't like that phrase, and prefer to use 'excess energy from food' - a polite way to say excess carbs in a bad-fats environment imho).

Oh yes we do. We sure do.

I would like to have brunch with Holly Van Hare. (In NYC? Oh yes please. I wonder if I could claim the airplane ticket on my taxes...) I would like to talk to her about the severe insulin resistance I got from eating excess carbs and bad for us oils, after being told to in the 1970s on, apparently for my health, that messed up my metabolism and wrecked my liver and pancreas so my life expectancy is lowered by 10 years, at least according to my life insurers. (Yeah, I can get expressive about the wrecked health from food thing. More of us should, I believe.) (I won't even go into body fat storage, ie obesity.) How low carbs and fasting is the best way to try and get some years back, hopefully healthier liver function, but that this may not happen.

This type of info on the internet makes the job of the 'diet and exercise against insulin resistance' communicators (which I consider myself one) soooooo much harder. And the price is many more people's good health - it's not like we are discussing an interesting philosophical difference here. This is people's lives, limbs, kidneys - well you all know the story.

I'm upset too. I'm trying to help my friend, but because of these articles, it's going to be so much harder. Hoping, hoping with time and perseverance I'll make a difference in her life.

17 years ago, when I was diagnosed with pre-diabetes, I followed the same dietary advice as you, and worse yet, eventhough Protein Power by the Eades was published in 1995, and Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution was published in 1997, no one, not the diabetes organizations or groups, or my endocrinologist who I saw for 3 years, or my primary care doctor, or the nutritionists who taught the classes I attended, told me about the low carb keto diet even though I told them all I wanted a dietary strategy, not drugs. Like you, I'll only be able to undo some of the damage.

Again, it's a slow slog, but we are making progress. And this forum has played a huge role in restoring my health. I'm so grateful...
 
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Tophat1900

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Fear is the often used tactic.... a tactic that comes about due to desperation .
 

Winnie53

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I don't know Tophat1900. Not sure what the second part of your comment means. I think it's all about generating traffic to your site these days. Everyone has bills to pay. I'm trying to not judge her. I do stupid things too, often not realizing it until much later. I finally figured out how I came across the article last night. It was in my MSN.com news feed in the "Health and Fitness" section. It's still there tonight.

The awful thing is she may be helping a few people, like HSSS for example, but she's hurting far, far more diabetics.
 
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ert

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The source is the Daily Mail. They also publish articles on people spontaneously combusting.