Blood Sugar

[Route 66]

Three weeks ago I suffered a Heart Attack and was diagnosed with T2 Diabetes whilst in hospital. I am on 24 units of insulin before breakfast and 14 units before evening meal.

I should have seen the warning signs - Drinking a lot and going to the loo a lot but I didn't.

For the last three weeks I given up full sugar coke (Was drinking 1.5 litres a day), all sugar in tea/coffee, white bread (Only 2-3 slices of wholemeal now) and trying to eat much more sensibly.

After three weeks, I am still getting high blood sugar readings - Before breakfast between 8 and 12 and during the day between 9 and 11.

I was hoping to see it start to come down after three weeks of being good.

Any advice on how long before I start to see it come down - Am I doing something wrong?

Also is 24 and 14 units of insulin high or not?

I am at the bottom of a steep learning curve and very little answers from GP.

All advice appreciated.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

I've never been on insulin, managed to avoid it, thankfully... As for what you're doing wrong, i don't know... Could be anything. The bread for instance. Doesn't matter whether it's white or brown, it's carby, and you'll have to process those carbs whether they're high or low on the glycemic index. That's the thing with us.... We can't handle the carbs. So if you still have anything made with flour, like bread, pasta or wraps, or things like potatoes, rice, corn, porridge, cereal, fruit (berries are okay, but that's about it), all those things will make your bloodsugars go up. The thing is, if you cut them out completely today, and keep taking the insulin you're on right now, you're going to hypo. So if you want to change anything about your diet to get the T2 under control, don't do it out of the blue, you need a meter to keep your levels in check and you need your medical team on your side on this... Just cutting carbs when on bloodsugar lowering medication can go bad really, really fast, with your bloodsugars dropping like a stone. So read up about what could help (https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/blog-entry/the-nutritional-thingy.2330/, dietdoctor.com, The Diabetes Code by dr. Jason Fung, this forum's website), and then decide, with help from your team, what your next step is going to be. Just please be careful, whatever you do.

Good luck!
Jo

 

[LittleGreyCat]

@Route 66 it would help if you told us what you are eating, as well as what you have cut out.

One common cause of confusion for the newly diagnosed is that we talk about blood sugar levels, and it is assumed that it is sugar in your food that becomes sugar in your blood.

This is only a small part of the story.
Sugar is a fast acting carbohydrate, however virtually ALL carbohydrates will turn into sugar (glucose) in your blood.
There are really no "good" carbohydrates.

Beware "no added sugar" foods, for example. This doesn't mean that they are a wise choice for T2 diabetics.

So tell us what you usually eat, and we can offer plenty of (often good) advice.

 

[Resurgam]

three slices of bread would be my entire day's carbs, I much prefer to have a stir fry and a salad and a couple of times a week have berries and cream as a dessert - plus I don't need any medication. I know I am lucky, but low carb is a powerful took to bring down blood glucose. Naturally you need to have sufficient carbs to counteract the insulin and keep everything in balance, but dense carbohydrate foods could be the reason for spikes and generally high readings.

 

[DCUKMod]

@Route 66 - As someone newly diagnosed, it can take the body a little while to let go of the higher readings. This coupled with your recent heart attck means your higher numbers are not unexpected.

Those who have commented already are correct, in that T2s usually have to be fairly careful with our diet, and have learned along the way that a brown carb is just as tricky for us to handle as a white one. I found wholemeal, versus white bread or pasta made no difference to me.

One thing I will say though, loud and clear, is to be very careful indeed of changing your diet too much so early in your journey with insulin. Insulin is a powerful substance and can both keep us alive or kill us.

Just finally, when folks are started on insulin, there's usually a professional guestimate comes into play, based on what you say you eat and drink, along with your height and weight. Over time, it can usually be adjusted, to match what you are eating, and your activity levels.

In these early days, be very careful indeed. Please stay very close to your diabetes team.

 

[Route 66]

@Route 66 it would help if you told us what you are eating, as well as what you have cut out.

One common cause of confusion for the newly diagnosed is that we talk about blood sugar levels, and it is assumed that it is sugar in your food that becomes sugar in your blood.

This is only a small part of the story.
Sugar is a fast acting carbohydrate, however virtually ALL carbohydrates will turn into sugar (glucose) in your blood.
There are really no "good" carbohydrates.

Beware "no added sugar" foods, for example. This doesn't mean that they are a wise choice for T2 diabetics.

So tell us what you usually eat, and we can offer plenty of (often good) advice.

@Route 66 it would help if you told us what you are eating, as well as what you have cut out.

One common cause of confusion for the newly diagnosed is that we talk about blood sugar levels, and it is assumed that it is sugar in your food that becomes sugar in your blood.

This is only a small part of the story.
Sugar is a fast acting carbohydrate, however virtually ALL carbohydrates will turn into sugar (glucose) in your blood.
There are really no "good" carbohydrates.

Beware "no added sugar" foods, for example. This doesn't mean that they are a wise choice for T2 diabetics.

So tell us what you usually eat, and we can offer plenty of (often good) advice.

Hi Little Grey Cat

I have cut out sugar in tea/coffee as well as on cereals and replaced it with Canderel. I have stopped drinking fizzy pop and fruit squash and now drink just water and tea. All take aways are now right out of the window as are cakes, biscuits, chocolate and pastry.

My day usually starts with cereal, but having read a number of posts on here, I have started having poached eggs sometimes with sausage or bacon. For a midday meal I usually have a couple of cheese and tomato sandwiches (Three rounds of bread - Wholemeal) and for dinner I have chicken or lean meat with a small number of new potatoes or mashed potato mixed with sweet potato. Tonight it is a ham salad with new pots. I seem to get hungry again about supper time and have a light snack usually a few cheesy biscuits and a couple of low fat cheese triangles.

Help !!!!

 

[bulkbiker]

Hi Little Grey Cat


Help !!!!

Bread and potatoes will be causing a blood sugar spike and then crash which is why you are getting hungry again.
Lean meat is not as good as fattier meat ... this will keep you feeling full for longer so you won't need the snacks.
Chicken thighs are better than breast.. pork belly over loin.. that kind of thing.
Eat full fat items and you'll lose the hunger and the pounds if you have some spare!

 

[Route 66]

@Route 66 - As someone newly diagnosed, it can take the body a little while to let go of the higher readings. This coupled with your recent heart attck means your higher numbers are not unexpected.

Those who have commented already are correct, in that T2s usually have to be fairly careful with our diet, and have learned along the way that a brown carb is just as tricky for us to handle as a white one. I found wholemeal, versus white bread or pasta made no difference to me.

One thing I will say though, loud and clear, is to be very careful indeed of changing your diet too much so early in your journey with insulin. Insulin is a powerful substance and can both keep us alive or kill us.

Just finally, when folks are started on insulin, there's usually a professional guestimate comes into play, based on what you say you eat and drink, along with your height and weight. Over time, it can usually be adjusted, to match what you are eating, and your activity levels.

In these early days, be very careful indeed. Please stay very close to your diabetes team.

Hi DCUKMod

Many thanks for the advice. I was very worried as I expected the numbers to fall a bit by now.

I really didn't understand that brown bread could be as bad as white.

My height is 6 foot 2 inches and weight is 92kgs.

Three weeks ago when I was started on insulin, I was put on 24 units in the morning and 12 units in the evening. This was adjusted 10 days ago to 24 and 14. I wondered if this was a high dose?

I am seeing the diabetic nurse again the week after next.

Just want to try and make sure I am doing the right things to avoid another Heart attack.

 

[Route 66]

Bread and potatoes will be causinga blood sugar spike and then crash which is why you are getting hungry again.
Lean meat is not as good as fattier meat ... this will keep you feeling full for longer so you won't need the snacks.
Chicken thighs are better than breast.. pork belly over loin.. that kind of thing.
Eat full fat items and you'll lose the hunger and the pounds if you have some spare!

Hi Bulkbiker

Thanks so much for the advice. That is so helpful.

I am trying to avoid losing too much weight as I think I may have had diabetes for a few years. I have been losing weight and muscle mass over about 4 years and was thinking it was down to old age.

 

[Route 66]

three slices of bread would be my entire day's carbs, I much prefer to have a stir fry and a salad and a couple of times a week have berries and cream as a dessert - plus I don't need any medication. I know I am lucky, but low carb is a powerful took to bring down blood glucose. Naturally you need to have sufficient carbs to counteract the insulin and keep everything in balance, but dense carbohydrate foods could be the reason for spikes and generally high readings.

Thank you so much for the advice Resurgam

 

[bulkbiker]

Hi Bulkbiker

Thanks so much for the advice. That is so helpful.

I am trying to avoid losing too much weight as I think I may have had diabetes for a few years. I have been losing weight and muscle mass over about 4 years and was thinking it was down to old age.

That's quite an important piece of info as weight loss isn't that common for T2's.
If by cutting carbs your blood sugar levels don't improve then it could well be worth getting some further testing done.
What sort of levels are you currently seeing out of interest?

 

[Route 66]

That's quite an important piece of info as weight loss isn't that common for T2's.
If by cutting carbs your blood sugar levels don't improve then it could well be worth getting some further testing done.
What sort of levels are you currently seeing out of interest?

Today
1300 - 11.5
0830 - 10.9

13th
1900 - 8.6
1300 - 9.8
0830 - 12.5

12th
1300 - 9.7
0830 - 10.3

11th
2230 - 9.7
1500 - 11.4 (Suffering Headaches)
0830 - 10.3

10th
1900 - 6.9
1300 - 8.8
0830 - 10.1

9th
1900 - 6.1
0830 - 8.5

8th
1900 - 7.2
0830 - 8.3

 

[DCUKMod]

Hi DCUKMod

Many thanks for the advice. I was very worried as I expected the numbers to fall a bit by now.

I really didn't understand that brown bread could be as bad as white.

My height is 6 foot 2 inches and weight is 92kgs.

Three weeks ago when I was started on insulin, I was put on 24 units in the morning and 12 units in the evening. This was adjusted 10 days ago to 24 and 14. I wondered if this was a high dose?

I am seeing the diabetic nurse again the week after next.

Just want to try and make sure I am doing the right things to avoid another Heart attack.

Hi there, in terms of you dose, being high, or otherwise, that's all very personal. Ssome folks can appear largely similar, yet have very different insulin needs. According to the NHS BMI calculator, trimming up a bit could be beneficial, although you're not massively heavy.

For now, you need to concentrate on your recovery. Do plenty of reading on here, but please, please, don't make significnt dietary changes until you speak to your Doc/Nurse to agree how to manage your insulin, if you are changing what you eat. That is important. As you change what you eat, your insulin needs could change quite bit.

 

[Route 66]

Hi there, in terms of you dose, being high, or otherwise, that's all very personal. Ssome folks can appear largely similar, yet have very different insulin needs. According to the NHS BMI calculator, trimming up a bit could be beneficial, although you're not massively heavy.

For now, you need to concentrate on your recovery. Do plenty of reading on here, but please, please, don't make significnt dietary changes until you speak to your Doc/Nurse to agree how to manage your insulin, if you are changing what you eat. That is important. As you change what you eat, your insulin needs could change quite bit.

Thank you so much.

Your advice really helps.

 

[Marie 2]

This is just something I like to warn all newly diagnosed diabetics that are having a problem with control! It sounds like you have had issues for a while and weight loss just isn't common with type 2 as it is type 1.

There are a lot of us misdiagnosed type 1's out there, it happens too often. So if you end up doing everything right and still are having a problem keep in mind you could be a misdiagnosed type 1.

 

[LittleGreyCat]

<Snip>

My height is 6 foot 2 inches and weight is 92kgs.

<snip>

I just ran your numbers through the BMI calculator and that shows you with a BMI of 26 which is over weight.

It would probably be better for you to have your BMI close to the middle of the healthy range.

I note that you say that you don't want to lose any weight.
Given that you are overweight and that is a high risk factor for both diabetes and heart issues, could you explain why?

If it is because people are saying that you are slim enough already, ignore them!

 

[Route 66]

I just ran your numbers through the BMI calculator and that shows you with a BMI of 26 which is over weight.

It would probably be better for you to have your BMI close to the middle of the healthy range.

I note that you say that you don't want to lose any weight.
Given that you are overweight and that is a high risk factor for both diabetes and heart issues, could you explain why?

If it is because people are saying that you are slim enough already, ignore them!

Hi Little Greycat,

I have lost about 2 stones in weight over about 4 years, which is now being attributed to the diabetes over some time. I have also lost bulk in my arm and leg muscles. I am more than happy to shed a bit more weight, but would like to regain some muscle. Unfortunately due to my heart attack, I am unable to start Cardio rehab in the gym until after my follow up with the Cardiologist in Mid July.

 

[LittleGreyCat]

Hi Little Greycat,

I have lost about 2 stones in weight over about 4 years, which is now being attributed to the diabetes over some time. I have also lost bulk in my arm and leg muscles. I am more than happy to shed a bit more weight, but would like to regain some muscle. Unfortunately due to my heart attack, I am unable to start Cardio rehab in the gym until after my follow up with the Cardiologist in Mid July.

To be a bit brutal about it, if you have lost muscle than you have retained fat.
If it were me I would concentrate on eating to lose some fat because I would expect that to help your heart health and your diabetes.
I understand that you can't exercise for the moment; however you will be able to in the future and I can't see losing some fat doing you any harm whatsoever.

 

[Route 66]

To be a bit brutal about it, if you have lost muscle than you have retained fat.
If it were me I would concentrate on eating to lose some fat because I would expect that to help your heart health and your diabetes.
I understand that you can't exercise for the moment; however you will be able to in the future and I can't see losing some fat doing you any harm whatsoever.

Thank you for the advice which I will try to follow. Hopefully some exercise when I can will help with the muscles.

 

[Route 66]

This is just something I like to warn all newly diagnosed diabetics that are having a problem with control! It sounds like you have had issues for a while and weight loss just isn't common with type 2 as it is type 1.

There are a lot of us misdiagnosed type 1's out there, it happens too often. So if you end up doing everything right and still are having a problem keep in mind you could be a misdiagnosed type 1.

Hi Marie,

I did wonder about that as the hospital carried out no tests other than finger pricks and put me straight on insulin whilst I was an inpatient. Now been on insulin 3 weeks.

I will speak with the GP.