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Confusion within NHS Over The Treatment of Tyoe 2

To get back to the original point, one reason for the confusion about how to treat type 2 is that it is not a single illness, but a group of illnesses into which those not specifically categorised otherwise, are lumped together.
 
bamba said:
To get back to the original point, one reason for the confusion about how to treat type 2 is that it is not a single illness, but a group of illnesses into which those not specifically categorised otherwise, are lumped together.
Click to expand...
Thanks for replying.
 
Ladies and gentlemen. Please stop bickering and name calling.

The forum is not here for bickering. Should anyone have issues they wish to raise with another individual, please do it via Private Message or hit the Report button.

Sgould further editing be required on this thread, it is likely escalated moderation will be required. Should you be unclear what that means, please refresh your acquaintance with the Community Ethos and Forum Rules.

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/community-ethos-forum-rules.50278/

Thank you.
 
Aphorism said:
Hi
NICE states that a liver function test should be made prior to being prescribed Pioglitazone.
If my pancreas is kaput then the next stage is normally insulin injections to lower my blood sugar. I will not take the drug prescribed; France and Germany have highly efficient health systems, I am assured, and their judgement is final for me. Plus, in the USA their are pending high profile court cases brought by people affected, apparently, by this drug causing bladder cancer and fluid around the heart (leading to heart failure).
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https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/ng...abetes-in-adults-management-pdf-1837338615493 There is a later, 2017 version I think but I can't find it. I hope this helps
 
Sue192 said:
Good grief. @Rachox was merely repeating what you yourself said, and other posters are only trying to help.

I fear it will be going round and round in circles....

Post edited by a Mod
Click to expand...

Just for the record I’m not quite sure what you are referring to now that some posts have been deleted. However I want @Aphorism to know that I haven’t been personally offended by him at all.
 
Aphorism said:
Hi
I am finding now that things are getting very foggy in the NHS regarding the treatment, diet etc of people with type 2, which I myself suffer.
I have been type 2 for a decade, although a previous doctor failed to make a simple diagnoses after de facto evidence of classic type 2 symptoms; which led to urinary tract complications and having to undergo a full circumsition in my 50s. Nightmare!
Anyway, my cholesterol levels have always been historically low, consequently I refused to take statins on the basis that they made me ill and they were not needed to lower what is a low personal cholesterol count anyway. Now the doctor has just tried to get me to take Pioglitazone, but failed to mention the risks, even the fact Germany and France have banned this controversial drug.
Interesting, this was my doctor's response to my pancreas showing signs of packing up, and the possibility of myself having to take insulin! Confusing.
My doctor has told me that apparently the usual way of measuring blood sugar is out! Now he uses a different method which I knew nothing about - let alone actually understanding what it all means (no leaflet or web link to help was given).
When I had my last blood sugar test it proved to be high; although I was being treated for an infection and was post prandial, having eaten my breakfast three hours before the blood was taken; facts he refused to consider. Confusing!
I will not take Pioglitazone on the informed basis that the risk outways the confidence of success; apparently all patients must have a liver function test, especially if in the past you have suffered liver damage (with me it was a gallstone problem). I did not.
Some friends and relatives have told me to change doctors!
Plus, NHS staff all seem to have their own views! Confusing!
Finally, on my low carb diet I have lost 2 stone in weight and I exercise rigorously every morning.
But I remain confused.
Thanks for reading this!
Click to expand...
've just seen this about that drug you mentioned pioglitazone! https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes-complications/bladder-cancer.html
"In 2011 bladder cancer and diabetes have been in the news as a correlation between bladder cancer and people taking the diabetes drug Actos (pioglitazone) was found."

 
Tannith said:
've just seen this about that drug you mentioned pioglitazone! https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes-complications/bladder-cancer.html
"In 2011 bladder cancer and diabetes have been in the news as a correlation between bladder cancer and people taking the diabetes drug Actos (pioglitazone) was found."
Click to expand...
Thank you for your help; type two is so very different from type one, and the controversy over this drug is just one issue of many type two sufferers have to wrangle with.
Cheers for taking the time to post something constructive.
 
Aphorism said:
Hi
I am finding now that things are getting very foggy in the NHS regarding the treatment, diet etc of people with type 2, which I myself suffer.
I have been type 2 for a decade, although a previous doctor failed to make a simple diagnoses after de facto evidence of classic type 2 symptoms; which led to urinary tract complications and having to undergo a full circumsition in my 50s. Nightmare!
Anyway, my cholesterol levels have always been historically low, consequently I refused to take statins on the basis that they made me ill and they were not needed to lower what is a low personal cholesterol count anyway. Now the doctor has just tried to get me to take Pioglitazone, but failed to mention the risks, even the fact Germany and France have banned this controversial drug.
Interesting, this was my doctor's response to my pancreas showing signs of packing up, and the possibility of myself having to take insulin! Confusing.
My doctor has told me that apparently the usual way of measuring blood sugar is out! Now he uses a different method which I knew nothing about - let alone actually understanding what it all means (no leaflet or web link to help was given).
When I had my last blood sugar test it proved to be high; although I was being treated for an infection and was post prandial, having eaten my breakfast three hours before the blood was taken; facts he refused to consider. Confusing!
I will not take Pioglitazone on the informed basis that the risk outways the confidence of success; apparently all patients must have a liver function test, especially if in the past you have suffered liver damage (with me it was a gallstone problem). I did not.
Some friends and relatives have told me to change doctors!
Plus, NHS staff all seem to have their own views! Confusing!
Finally, on my low carb diet I have lost 2 stone in weight and I exercise rigorously every morning.
But I remain confused.
Thanks for reading this!
Click to expand...

Yes, Do change doctors but in my experience they are all very limited, even so called specialist Diabetic Endroconologists as they all treat the disease and NOT the patient. Sadly us diabetics (type 2 in my case) generally present with very complex issues and most medical professionals cannot be bothered with patients who don't conform to their tick boxes. AND don't forget they all have to slavishly follow NICE guidelines or their practice/department cannot maximise funding. The NEW way of recording sugar levels is simply that ...if you check the NICE website they should have a simple comparison chart btwn old and "new money" to help you get a handle on it. I think this site might have one but I can't find it at the moment. Your diabetic nurse should be able to give you one...O and try google search. Sorry not computer literate enuf to send a link.
 
Aphorism said:
I know docs are under pressure and empathise, truly. However, when a doc is a diabetes specialist he or she needs to be absolutely clear with their patients. Footnote; my doc said that if he were a lawyer the bill would be mounting up! And it was not a joke.☹️
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If he were a lawyer it would be a heck of a lot easier to find a better and more effective one and he would be a whole lot easier to sue.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
cmhdiabetes said:
Yes, Do change doctors but in my experience they are all very limited, even so called specialist Diabetic Endroconologists as they all treat the disease and NOT the patient. Sadly us diabetics (type 2 in my case) generally present with very complex issues and most medical professionals cannot be bothered with patients who don't conform to their tick boxes. AND don't forget they all have to slavishly follow NICE guidelines or their practice/department cannot maximise funding. The NEW way of recording sugar levels is simply that ...if you check the NICE website they should have a simple comparison chart btwn old and "new money" to help you get a handle on it. I think this site might have one but I can't find it at the moment. Your diabetic nurse should be able to give you one...O and try google search. Sorry not computer literate enuf to send a link.
Click to expand...

Many thanks for
cmhdiabetes said:
Yes, Do change doctors but in my experience they are all very limited, even so called specialist Diabetic Endroconologists as they all treat the disease and NOT the patient. Sadly us diabetics (type 2 in my case) generally present with very complex issues and most medical professionals cannot be bothered with patients who don't conform to their tick boxes. AND don't forget they all have to slavishly follow NICE guidelines or their practice/department cannot maximise funding. The NEW way of recording sugar levels is simply that ...if you check the NICE website they should have a simple comparison chart btwn old and "new money" to help you get a handle on it. I think this site might have one but I can't find it at the moment. Your diabetic nurse should be able to give you one...O and try google search. Sorry not computer literate enuf to send a link.
Click to expand...

Hi there and many thanks for your welcome and constructive advice; I appreciate it! Interesting stuff.
It concerns me that docs sometimes try to throw expensive drugs at you, especially the controversial ones like Pioglitazone which has been banned in France and Germany and has pending court cases in the USA where it is claimed it caused several fatal side effects involving heart attack/failure and bladder cancer and a number of other complications. I feel I was able to make a personal informed decision not to possibly leave my partner too soon, and will not take thus drug. I myself have lost two stone and exercise rigorously on an elliptical cross trainer machine, daily without fail, and have a good muscle ratio. My weight is now 15.5 stone although I have a large rugby player build so losing another two stone might be difficult. On the low carb diet it's been a revelation in feeling so much healthier and fitter. Yet, my blood sugar is still too high! So, now it has been mooted my pancreas is shutting down and maybe insulin jabs are the way to go. We will see what transpires.
Kind regards!
 
NoCrbs4Me said:
The standard western medical treatment for type 2 diabetes is:
1. Follow the government recommended low fat high carb diet.
2. Metformin.
3. A statin.
4. A blood pressure reducing med.

As the patient’s blood glucose levels rise, prescribe stronger diabetes meds until finally they need to be on insulin.
Click to expand...
Yes, I think that covers it.
 
Aphorism said:
Hi
I am finding now that things are getting very foggy in the NHS regarding the treatment, diet etc of people with type 2, which I myself suffer.
I have been type 2 for a decade, although a previous doctor failed to make a simple diagnoses after de facto evidence of classic type 2 symptoms; which led to urinary tract complications and having to undergo a full circumsition in my 50s. Nightmare!
Anyway, my cholesterol levels have always been historically low, consequently I refused to take statins on the basis that they made me ill and they were not needed to lower what is a low personal cholesterol count anyway. Now the doctor has just tried to get me to take Pioglitazone, but failed to mention the risks, even the fact Germany and France have banned this controversial drug.
Interesting, this was my doctor's response to my pancreas showing signs of packing up, and the possibility of myself having to take insulin! Confusing.
My doctor has told me that apparently the usual way of measuring blood sugar is out! Now he uses a different method which I knew nothing about - let alone actually understanding what it all means (no leaflet or web link to help was given).
When I had my last blood sugar test it proved to be high; although I was being treated for an infection and was post prandial, having eaten my breakfast three hours before the blood was taken; facts he refused to consider. Confusing!
I will not take Pioglitazone on the informed basis that the risk outways the confidence of success; apparently all patients must have a liver function test, especially if in the past you have suffered liver damage (with me it was a gallstone problem). I did not.
Some friends and relatives have told me to change doctors!
Plus, NHS staff all seem to have their own views! Confusing!
Finally, on my low carb diet I have lost 2 stone in weight and I exercise rigorously every morning.
But I remain confused.
Thanks for reading this!
Click to expand...
I was given Pioglitazone about 12 years ago I broke out in huge blisters all over and itched beyond belief. I was immediately referred to a skin specialist who said that this would be recorded as an official side effect and placed on some register or other. Even now, after 12 years, it appears across the top of my medical records. I agree with everything you say about the confusion in the NHS about type 2 diabetes. I am now on insulin as well as medication in tablet form.
 
Liver damage may not be a complication o f diabetes, but taking all drugs for diabetes, worse than useless statins, blood pressure meds, the liver stores them all, as it doesn't know how to deal with them,as it does not recognise these chemicals as food. That leads to liver cancer. My husband died because of this. Was not discovered till he was stage 4.an LFT test may have saved him, so make sure you DO get this checked regularly. It was very aggressive, nothing could be done for him.
 
The adverse effects of Pioglitazone outweighs the advantages. From my experience of taking it over about 5 years it is a dangerous medication.

For almost one year of my stopping, some side effects are still persisting. Pioglitazone should be banned permanently in the UK.

Sent from my E6683 using DCUK Forum mobile app
 
NoCrbs4Me said:
The standard western medical treatment for type 2 diabetes is:
1. Follow the government recommended low fat high carb diet.
2. Metformin.
3. A statin.
4. A blood pressure reducing med.

As the patient’s blood glucose levels rise, prescribe stronger diabetes meds until finally they need to be on insulin.
Click to expand...

That sums up my experience exactly.
 
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