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COVID vaccination

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by notafanofsugar, Nov 14, 2020.

  1. urbanracer

    urbanracer Type 1 · Expert
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    THIS statisic from the US is quite revealing I think.
     
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  2. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    I would venture the following
    differences in social mobility and social mores and increasing participation in large scale events and gatherings.
    High vaccinating countries tend to be the ones reducing lockdowns early, and many many countries are still entering or extending severe lockdown measures (New Zealand, Australia, South Korea, Japan, Myanmar India etc to name a few)
    vaccinations give a false sense of security encouraging the easing of restrictions and 'allowing' close personal interactions in public, but also within the family groupings. Weddings, parties, family gatherings, vacations, sporting events, concerts
     
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  3. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    So the vaccine isn't much good then?
     
  4. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    This isn't a statistic from America but from Dr Malone the father of the mRNA vaccines.
    He's done a number of interviews now which have enraged the establishment to the point he has been removed from Wiki as father of the vaccine and been replaced by someone else.
    That is revisionism of the most blatant 1984 kind.
    What on earth is going on?

    Dr. Robert Malone, who pioneered the mRNA vaccine technology is concerned that the countries with the smallest percentage of their population vaccinated have the fewest number of new Covid cases. Countries with the largest percentages of population vaccinated have surging numbers of new Covid cases.
    https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/20...ost-vaxxed-countries-not-in-the-least-vaxxed/
     
  5. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    Can you please supply the connection between the article linked and Dr Malone? I am unable to connect him to it.
    The link you provide seems to me from a very dodgy source indeed and is badly written. I would not put my trust in it either.
     
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  6. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Paul Craig Roberts used to be head of the US treasury dept but has gone a bit rouge by publishing a lot of home truths over the last dozen years about government UN the WHO so he's obviously classed as dodgy now.
    Even the famous John Pilger is now dodgy because he does what he has always done and published and exposed. That's what he has always done and we loved him for it and he won awards and because he's carrying on doing that he's now dodgy.
    See if I can find an interview for you.
     
  7. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Here you go>>>>>
     
  8. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    There has been a lot of confusion about the vaccines since day one and the disease.
    It was originally a respiratory disease and then the SALK institute declared that no it is primarily a vascular disease.
    The vaccines reprogram your cells to produce something they never have done before... the spike protein.
    It turns out the spike protein is a toxin all on i5's own and it travels all through your body affecting brain lungs spinal cord and heart and that's where the blood clots and blood leaks and heart damage and death come in.
    The reason the vaccine is very dodgy for me is I have brain and spinal cord tumours heart disease and lung disease.
    I have no P wave on heart readings meaning my heart beat is not consistent. My blood is thick and sticky.
    The mantra of the benefits far outweigh the risks doesn't ring true for me and my multiple conditions.
     
  9. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I asked for and got last Wednesday a pneumonia vaccine as my COPD was recently diagnosed more accurately as bronchiectasis.
    It was my small amount of research that lead me to ask for the vaccine and the doctor said good call.
     
  10. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    Dr Malone worked at the original SALK Labs where they produced the basic mRNA vehicle used by the covid vaccinations. He holds the patents on this technology, so when the world governments and the manufacturers agreed to waive patent rights, he lost out with no compensation. I suspect he is slightly miffed by this.
     
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  11. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    One important point is that vaccines do not manufacture a spike protein. The spike protein already exists and is part and parcel of the ACE-2 enzyme, and it is this that provides Covid virus with its easy entry point to infect us. The mRNA vaccine mimics Covid virus to a close but inert facsimile of the virus, and by this trains our immune systems to recognise the covid virus and activate our own inbuilt immunity responses. So the vaccine does not fight the infections, our own body does that.
     
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  12. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    I can see why you fear the possibility of blood clots from the vaccine, as far as I can see it was only the AZ vaccine that is associated with this side effect, and that is not an mRNA type at all, so I fail to see the relevance of Dr Malone. If I had those health issues myself, I would be very fearful of contracting Covid itself, since that is documented and shown to be the major cause of death in ICU from the disease. Thus I would be keen to get as much protection as I can.
     
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  13. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    For anyone in doubt about the spike protein, may I recommend research into the role of the ACE-2 enzyme in the task of regulating blood pressure in the human body. You will discover that our bodies have been producing spike proteins naturally for millenia since it is like insulin, it is a key that opens a pathway into blood cells . Covid is dangerous because it has evolved the neat trick of building mimics and copies of this protein key, so it has a passepartout into our blood stream which it exploits to insert its own DNA and RNA codes into our cells which our bodies then replicate unless challenged by the immune system. It is the DNA in the virus that is the 'living' part and this controls cell replication. The RNA code is merely a shopping list that creates the means to do so and is also the trigger alien item that identifies an intruder to be explled.

    What an old style vaccine does is incubate the virus in egg embryo's then kill off the DNA part thus when injected it cannot replicate itself, but does insert the RNA code into our cells. Our immune system learns to recognize this RNA as being alien, so it attacks any cells that have this RNA and thus shuts down the viral activiry. The new Covid vaccines do the same thing using a generic Spike protein carrier to kick the process off.

    The Spike protein is NOT toxic. But any virus or bacteria that can emulate it or copy it has a passkey into our bodies, so we have an inbuilt weakness there. There are several medications that many of us here are using that use this very same technique to deliver their payload. It is a mechanism we already exploit in ACE, ARB and Angiotensin blood pressure medications. So the mRNA vaccines are not completly new, but use already proven technologies such as gene splicing, the spike protein based carriers and other well understood components. The new part is merely identifying, isolating, and extracting the appropriate RNA section of the viral code. This is also the bit that will change as new variants need to be dealt with.
     
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  14. hankjam

    hankjam Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    With respect..... what does this mean?
     
  15. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    It's to do with what is regarded as false news v real news.
    The main stream media in all its forms will no longer publish very much of what the likes of Pilger writes because it's real journalism which puts him outside of the MSM agenda of ********.
    That's about it.
    The MSM are so financially dependant on massive corporations including banks oil pharma that anything that isn't MSM like Pilger is derided as fake news.
    Which means most voters readers and your generally intelligent western person is buried beneath a great big pile of bull pooh.
    If you don't read the papers you're ill informed if you do read the papers you're misinformed is an old maxim that has never been truer than today.
     
  16. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    Bosh! Your echo chamber is tuned to some very dubious sources indeed. It is clear you have not done due diligence research into how the virus or the vaccines work, and the misleading information is coming from your posts here. Please do proper research,
    Edited to remove inflammatory remark.
     
    #436 Oldvatr, Jul 31, 2021 at 9:44 AM
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2021
  17. Jaylee

    Jaylee Type 1 · Moderator
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    Hi guys,

    Bringing the gavel down.

    Can we maintain civility in this discussion.
    Also when challenged on a view. Please provide a reputable source by way of a link.

    I thank you..
     
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  18. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to take so long getting back to you but I've been unwell.

    COVID-19 mRNA vaccines give instructions for our cells to make a harmless piece of what is called the “spike protein.” The spike protein is found on the surface of the virus that causes COVID-19.
    From the very dodgy CDC site.
    https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html

    We now know of course that the so called vaccine doesn't stay in the muscle but travels throughout our entire bodies and that's why the SALK institute recently announced it is not primarily a respiratory disease but a vascular one.
     
  19. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    As I stated in an earlier post here, our bodies manufacture spike proteins all over the place, it is a process we all do every day. The Ace-2 receptor is specifically a docking port for enzymes having spikes. We would not stay alive without spike protein transfers.

    The trick that the vaccine people managed to conquer was to isolate the mRNA portion of the virus's internal mechanism, This segment by itself is merely a shopping list used by the virus when it replicates, but in itself the mRNA is an inactive and inert identifier. This is indeed inserted into human cells by the vaccine, which in turn adds the viral identifier to our normal tissue cells. Once identified our own cells use the spike protein transfer that they already have the inbuilt capability to do to inject themselves into the ACE-2 enzyme in the bloodstream, and this is then carried around the body as you say. but it is now a rogue cell that is attacked by our own immune response. This mechanism is also nothing new to our bodies. We do this daily for all sorts of unusual or unwanted or damaged cells. Bacteria, viruses, infections, cuts, wounds injections. It really is nothing to fear since it is what we are constantly doing since birth. We were designed to do this. The mRNA is the only clever bit that human intervention has manufactured. The fact that hundreds of millions of vaccine doses have been successfully injected into arms without causing serious side effects says a lot to me.

    We have the numbers now- We also have seen how effective the results have been. Even if there is a conspiracy to supply vaccines, and some are making a mint from it, that is not the main story. If the vaccine protects me and my family from a horrible disease, then I do not regret partaking of it. My childhood was full of inoculations and vaccinations. Polio, typhoid, cholera, smallpox, tuberculosis, measles mumps, German Measles. flu, pneumonia, Diptheria, whooping cough, etc. I have not had yellow fever, cholera, or ebola shots, but would have them if I need to travel to those areas where these diseases are rife. It makes sense to do this. Covid is just another one to add to the list,

    The argument regarding vascular or respiratory is pointless. The virus itself is airborne but can enter the body through many different entry points where mucus is secreted - eyes, throat, lungs. It enters the bloodstream via the ACE-2 enzyme and becomes bloodborne, but it has the greatest effect on the respiratory system by lodging in the lungs and causing severe respiratory distress. It also causes blood clots anywhere in the body, so it is both vascular and respiratory, just like Sars-Cov1 and avian flu were. Because we were already exposed to Sars-1 then we developed a large base of knowledge and experience of coronavirus transmission and genome, so when sars cov2 appeared, we were not starting from scratch. Again, as I stated previously, we had already begun to design medicines that also used the spike protein as a transfer mechanism.

    There is nothing magical or deceptive about the way the vaccines were developed. The science makes sense and the mechanisms were well understood and developed prior to the emergence of the virus. I am comfortable with the outcome we are benefitting from.

    Update: Where I use the term spike protein, I should technically refer to it as the S-protein, since our body proteins do not stick out as spikes. The Cov-2 spikes are also glycosylated to disguise them from immune responses, but the normal angiotensin proteins that dock with the ACE-2 enzyme are of course not glycosylated.
     
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    #439 Oldvatr, Aug 2, 2021 at 10:07 AM
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2021
  20. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    We don't have spike proteins flowing through our bodies.
     
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