Dawn dump

[SueJB]

I don't eat breakfast, OK sometimes I'll have a sliver of cheese. I've tried coffee with cream and I still get a dawn dump.
This morning BG @7am = 6.4 now 11am = 8.8 (had to test because I'm driving)
Does anyone have any successful antidump tips to share please?

 

[novorapidboi26]

Eating something should help as the digestion process will tell the liver its help is no longer required.

Its good that you are waking up in a reasonable target, so some may assume your total carb intake in general isn't excessive....

Getting a small carb in with some accompanying insulin should do the trick...

 

[LooperCat]

If you know you reliably get the dump every single day, you can take a small “foot on the floor” dose as soon as you wake up. I generally get woken between 5-7am with a dollop of cortisol which tells me my liver is about to dump glucose, so depending on what my Libre says, I inject a unit (or two if it’s above 7) of Novorapid, and that stops the dump, or at least soaks it up! It feels weird doing a correction dose when the BG is in range, but I did watch my Libre graph every morning for a week or two to work out what was actually happening in the mornings. I don’t always eat breakfast, but that doesn’t make any difference to my levels.

I’d advise watching closely to see exactly what happens in the morning for a week or so, and then work out a correction dose that will nip it in the bud. While keeping dextrose tabs handy at all times just in case of a hypo.

 

[Juicyj]

Hi @SueJB The best way to manage it is to do as @novorapidboi26 has mentioned, eat something small to send a signal to the liver to stop the dump and take your quick acting, it's evolution's answer to get up and go with a liver dump of glucose in the morning.

 

[SueJB]

Eating something should help as the digestion process will tell the liver its help is no longer required.

Its good that you are waking up in a reasonable target, so some may assume your total carb intake in general isn't excessive....

Getting a small carb in with some accompanying insulin should do the trick...

Thanks, not sure what small amount of carb I could eat

 

[SueJB]

If you know you reliably get the dump every single day, you can take a small “foot on the floor” dose as soon as you wake up. I generally get woken between 5-7am with a dollop of cortisol which tells me my liver is about to dump glucose, so depending on what my Libre says, I inject a unit (or two if it’s above 7) of Novorapid, and that stops the dump, or at least soaks it up! It feels weird doing a correction dose when the BG is in range, but I did watch my Libre graph every morning for a week or two to work out what was actually happening in the mornings. I don’t always eat breakfast, but that doesn’t make any difference to my levels.

I’d advise watching closely to see exactly what happens in the morning for a week or so, and then work out a correction dose that will nip it in the bud. While keeping dextrose tabs handy at all times just in case of a hypo.

Good idea, thanks. I know it's dumping because I get a hot flush. I'll try testing it at 11 everyday. I've don't have a half measure pen so it'd have to be one mmol but I'll keep checking.

 

[SueJB]

Hi @SueJB The best way to manage it is to do as @novorapidboi26 has mentioned, eat something small to send a signal to the liver to stop the dump and take your quick acting, it's evolution's answer to get up and go with a liver dump of glucose in the morning.

Thanks, I thought the cheese would tell it to stop.

 

[Juicyj]

Thanks, I thought the cheese would tell it to stop.

It's trial and error Sue but a small piece of cheese doesn't sound much at all, try eating some plain greek yoghurt instead ?

 

[novorapidboi26]

Yogurt was the carb I chose back when on injections.....

15g minimum.....

but it is trial and error.......what might work for me may not work for you.....you might need more carbs or something different to dairy...

 

[LooperCat]

Good idea, thanks. I know it's dumping because I get a hot flush. I'll try testing it at 11 everyday. I've don't have a half measure pen so it'd have to be one mmol but I'll keep checking.

If you ask at your clinic, they’ll give you a half unit pen. It’s wonderful for small nudges! I get woken when it’s about to dump with a hot flush and increased heart rate, so if I scan and correct straight away, most days I can stop it

 

[SueJB]

If you ask at your clinic, they’ll give you a half unit pen. It’s wonderful for small nudges! I get woken when it’s about to dump with a hot flush and increased heart rate, so if I scan and correct straight away, most days I can stop it

Mel, do you mean the diabetes clinic?

 

[LooperCat]

Mel, do you mean the diabetes clinic?

Yes - whoever you go to see for your diabetes care. Either GP or hospital clinic x

 

[Cassandra 2]

I don't eat breakfast, OK sometimes I'll have a sliver of cheese. I've tried coffee with cream and I still get a dawn dump.
This morning BG @7am = 6.4 now 11am = 8.8 (had to test because I'm driving)
Does anyone have any successful antidump tips to share please?

Breakfast, slow release energy such as porridge would help. Ditch the cheeses and cream with coffee.

 

[Antje77]

I take some insulin before my feet hit the floor, and I generally have only coffee with milk for breakfast. Works fine for me and I figured that one out before the Libre, just cost my insurance a lot of test strips to get it right . For me, taking about as much as I would for a slice of bread in the morning does the trick.

 

[SueJB]

Breakfast, slow release energy such as porridge would help. Ditch the cheeses and cream with coffee.

Nice idea but I can't stand the stuff and anyway that's just a few too many carbs

 

[LooperCat]

Nice idea but I can't stand the stuff and anyway that's just a few too many carbs

Do you like eggs? I just had aubergine eggy “bread” for breakfast. 3g carbs and will keep me going until mid afternoon.

Just fry a couple of slabs scored aubergine in a tbsp or so of butter (I spread it on both sides) until soft, and pour over a beaten egg and fry until set.

 

[SueJB]

Do you like eggs? I just had aubergine eggy “bread” for breakfast. 3g carbs and will keep me going until mid afternoon.

Just fry a couple of slabs scored aubergine in a tbsp or so of butter (I spread it on both sides) until soft, and pour over a beaten egg and fry until set.

View attachment 25999

Too late for today, just had a simple boiled egg but a definite winner for tomorrow. Thanks

 

[andrewbristol]

I take one or two units of Novorapid as soon as I get up to sort out the "foot on the floor" rise, then get out and do 10 mins walk come rain or shine. If I don't bolus and walk I'll be up to about 12mmol in the 45 mins or so before breakfast.

I did try a small dose of carbs (5-10g using milk) to see if my liver would stop dumping, but it made no difference for me.

I suspect my liver is not getting proper signalling from whatever insulin my pancreas can churn out.

I've got a consultant referral in June to look at what is going on. I also get massive post meal spikes (around 13/14mmol) even with correct bolus. The other hugely problematic thing is that exercise depletes my BG at a staggeringly fast rate - walk 20 mins and I'll drop 4mmol (or more with very fast walking). It's a pain in the backside as everything has to be planned, and this seems to point at the liver NOT dumping when it should. The positive flip side of this is that I can walk after meals as soon as BG takes off, and kill spikes quite effectively - I just have to not overdo it and hypo!

My 2cents worth is I may have a partial obstruction of the Portal Vein (which directs insulin from the Pancreas into Liver). A bit unusual, but would make sense as the Liver would not be receiving it's insulin signalling properly and this might explain my symptoms. I'll run this past the consultant.....

 

[LocoRoco]

I don't eat breakfast, OK sometimes I'll have a sliver of cheese. I've tried coffee with cream and I still get a dawn dump.
This morning BG @7am = 6.4 now 11am = 8.8 (had to test because I'm driving)
Does anyone have any successful antidump tips to share please?

Hey Sue ,

Ive been having the same problem . Not eating much in the morning - just coffee with milk and my glucose readings were 5,5mmol before and 11mmol after .

What helped for me was eating something with low-medium GI - I usually grab an apple or orange and eat 1 slice of small whole grain with peanut butter -around 30-40g of carbs , or maybe some yoghurt . The glucose levels are usually around 8mmol after breakfast .

 

[SueJB]

Hey Sue ,

Ive been having the same problem . Not eating much in the morning - just coffee with milk and my glucose readings were 5,5mmol before and 11mmol after .

What helped for me was eating something with low-medium GI - I usually grab an apple or orange and eat 1 slice of small whole grain with peanut butter -around 30-40g of carbs , or maybe some yoghurt . The glucose levels are usually around 8mmol after breakfast .

Someone else suggested Greek yoghurt or a little bit of carb but as I'm only sort of eating 30-40 g a day, the bread and peanut would blow my allowance.An small apple might be OK =10g or an orange at 8g. Thanks for the suggestions.