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Dr Mosley and the diet that reverses type 2 diabetes.

Discussion in 'Diabetes Discussions' started by Duncan57, Jan 18, 2016.

  1. Administrator

    Administrator Family member · Well-Known Member
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    That must make vegetables a little tricky - similar to how vegetarians (who are obviously avoiding meat) can find it a little trickier to pick other 'main' options. How are you finding it all? It seems you're doing great work.

    It's great to see the lower sugar/lower processed foods message being taken up so mainstream.

    Did you/do you feel hungry when you were eating low calorie opposed to low carb (or vice versa)? Vegetables are used for the satiety aspect, are there any particular foods that you consume for the satiety aspect?
     
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  2. 13lizanne

    13lizanne Type 2 · Expert

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    I eat a LOT of chicken, eggs, 97% sausage, gammon etc 1 slice Burgen soya + linseed bread toasted for breakfast with cheese and either veg soup OR cauliflower rice daily. Very limited variety of foods but quite satisfying because of the butter, cheese and the fat on meats. I also take a good multi vitamin with iron. I learned how to lchf from this forum and from www.thedietdoctor website (referenced from here) and as well as being able to come off Metformin after 9+ years am now relatively pain free, and have stopped strong painkillers for my gut problems also. Who knew lchf could do all that?
     
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  3. 13lizanne

    13lizanne Type 2 · Expert

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    And.. Yes, I did feel very hungry when eating low calorie but rarely feel hunger now that I'm eating lchf
     
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  4. Administrator

    Administrator Family member · Well-Known Member
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    The benefits of both LC and fasting (separately, not both at the same time) are incredible!
     
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  5. AloeSvea

    AloeSvea Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I really believe we need to keep our journalists honest - they are supposed to be our fourth estate, in democracies. It's not good enough if they, or their producers and publicists, or they themselves allow the "present[ing his personal angle" and not being "bogged down in the minutiae of whether he hasn't been as fulsome in his explanation as those of us who understand it all might like" when it is in actual fact a false presentation in order to come across as more credible or more dramatic in order to sell more of whatever.

    And on the subject of diabetes in the UK, and possibly even the English-speaking world - folk in this forum are probably 'it' for asking them to present honestly on the subject.
     
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  6. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    What is he being dishonest about?
     
  7. hankjam

    hankjam Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    He was "Shocked",
    how I wonder with his family history and his education.....
     
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  8. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    He admits that he shouldn't have been surprised. It's human nature to assume it won't happen to you.
     
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  9. runner2009

    runner2009 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Basically, journalist or not this is all a huge money grab to take advantage - make money - of the WORLD WIDE diabetic epidemic.

    In the US a TV show is promoting curing / reversing your diabetes.

    For $19.99 - regularly $97 value - plus a 365 money back guarantee, you get a step by step guide to reverse your diabetes if you are type 2.

    Can we guess what the secret are.

    1. Lose a **** load of weight
    2. Get a regular exercising program going
    3. Lose belly and visceral fat
    4. Stop eating processed foods
    5. Eat a low carb high ( fat / medium fat ) diet with healthy fats
    6. Cut your portion sizes
    7. 50% of your meal should be veggies
    8. Don't eat too much protien at any one sitting - it can convert into glucose
    9. Watch your fructose intake in any form focus on fruits such as avocados, cucumbers, eggplant and a few tomatoes and berries.

    If you do this and really focus on losing a **** load of weight you will be cured, have normal blood sugars or be in remission.

    Now that I've divulged the secrets to a cure, a remission, a reversal or a life time of normal blood sugar can everyone who's benefited send me a dollar ?

    If I could get only 50¢ from 10% of all the diabetics I'd can buy me a new pancreas.

    Links to advertising by a particular person, with a dubious cure that has to be paid for, removed.
     
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    #89 runner2009, Jan 25, 2016 at 11:09 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2016
  10. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    It wouldn't be an issue if type 2 diabetics got useful advice from their doctor or diabetes nurse.
     
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  11. runner2009

    runner2009 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    So true and that is why most of us are here
     
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  12. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    You don't believe the Newcastle diet can reverse type 2 diabetes for some people?
     
  13. runner2009

    runner2009 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Of course "some people" and some people with Type 2 can be "reversed" with intensive insulin therapy during the beginning stages of the disease that gives the worn out or dying beta cells a break. But it is expensive, and perceived dangerous because of hypos and insulin therapy is not the primary treatment for type 2 and people with insulin resistance.

    But many type 2s have both type 2 and type 1 antibodies when they are diagnosed.

    It's complicated, but once you've killed off your beta cells or worn them out at least for now they are not growing back.

    Reversal or cure is in most cases - not all because the disease is far from homogeneous - is a pipedreams. The most most of us can expect is to manage our disease.

    It is my understanding that NHS spend over 10% of its budget on diabetes and here in US there is talk there is talk it will bankrupt Medicare. If we could cure / reverse most peoples type 2 diabetes with these diets you don't think out of survival they would start implementing it nation wide.

    I think you said it we all can argue this until the cows come home.

    What I believe is that best we can manage our disease so we can have close to normal blood sugars some of the time for some of us, using different strategies and tactics.

    Sorry to rant like this. But I've been working all day and managing my BG that was super high this am. I've not used insulin, did kettle bell squats behind my desk and ran instead of eating lunch.

    I've only drank 130calories of Whey powder and finally my BG dropped ( did the whey powder drive a GPL-1 insulin response? ).

    I'm hungry and I am not going to eat until tomorrow and I'm cranky and sick of managing this so I can not use insulin, lose more weight and have normalised blood sugars
     
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  14. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to hear you're having a bad day. But that's the million dollar question: why does the health care industry advise newly diagnosed type 2 diabetics to eat mostly carbs and very little fat when they know this results in the diabetes getting worse? I have no idea. Group think? Job security? Who knows? However, I think that for the majority of newly diagnosed type 2 diabetics a LCHF diet will result in normal blood glucose regulation.
     
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  15. dano17439

    dano17439 Type 2 · Member

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    This thread is really interesting. In October my doctor put me on 2 Metformins a day and my HBA1C levels were increasing slightly. After some very scary home BS tests I decided to go on a LCHF diet.

    Fast forward to today and I have managed to lose about 1.5 stone. I test my blood every day and for the past month I have never seen a reading over 8mmols (was getting anything between 7 - 30 back in October)

    I'm still low carbing for breakfast and lunch, but I am now eating a few things at dinner to test what spikes my BS but nothing seems to really. For example I went out Saturday night, drunk ALOT of lager, had a curry with rice, and then when I got up (at lunchtime lol) had a wrap with some crisps on the side. I tested my blood 2 hours after my lunch and it rocked in at 5.8mmol which was surprising as it was a carb fest Saturday

    I had a blood test last week so am eagerly awaiting my results. I will be shocked if my HBA1C is not lower than it was in October, and im hoping that all I needed to do is lose a bit of weight to have better control over my sugars. Of course if this is the case, i'd like to go back down to 1 Metformin a day, and keep at the weight I am now

    Fingers crossed
     
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  16. Clivethedrive

    Clivethedrive Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Your making nice progress watch the portion control thats what catches most out
     
  17. AndBreathe

    AndBreathe I reversed my Type 2 · Expert
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    DId you test at any time between before going out for your beers and curry and 2 hours after your lunchtime wrap and crisps? If so, when did you test and what were those interim scores?

    Fingers crossed for your bloods.
     
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  18. runner2009

    runner2009 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    First of all congratulations on your weight loss. Yes, I am ranting about the use of the word cure and reversal and it being irresponsible used. Most of these claims, do not have follow up studies ( ND not included ), nor do they define the population they use as proof in any more detail than claiming they are type 2 diabetic.

    We all know that there is a **** load of difference between type 2 / 1.5 who's blood sugar raise to 300 and then drops to 60 in a period of a day or less, compared with type 2 that have only a delayed or reduced primary insulin response. And we also know that the type 2 / pre-diabetic diagnosis by the medical establishment is based solely on ones fasting sugars and A1C both can be a false negative and positive and the differences in the diagnosis is a couple of points.

    My point is that everyone with too high A1C and high Fasting blood sugars is lumped into one category of Type 2 diabetes - ignoring the fact that there are many different sub types and stages in this metabolic disease. We all know its not one group just by reading about others experiences in this forum.

    Yes, do I believe you can manage diabetes with life style changes? Of course I do and even long time Type 1s can too as Dr. Bernstein has shown.

    As I've written before what these cures all have in common are what we know already.
    1. LCHF diet ( high fat meaning moderate )
    2. No or minimal processed foods - including pasta and breads
    3. Lose weight the more the better
    4. Lose belly and viseral fat
    5. Up your exercise - the more the better
    6. Watch portion sizes
    7. 50% of food from veggies.
    8. Eat more fiber
    9. watch your intake of all types of fructose
    10. Eat a low calorie diet as much as you can.
    11. Watch protien as 50% can be converted to glucose.

    This is not revolutionary and basically it really comes down to 2 points, increase your activity and drastically reduce your calorie intake - all one has to do is go through Life Magazine archives and look at the pictures from the mid 1900s and back and the majority of people all have low BMIs.

    Am I still cranky from yesterday yes I am. I've got a high level of ketone in my blood from this low calorie diet. I've not taken insulin for now 5-days. Last night before bed my BG was 69 ( driven down by GPL-1 response from a whey shake? ). This am I woke with a BG of 158 and I'm hungry as can be.

    Cure for me is when I can get some new beta cells created from stem cells.

    Anyway good work on the weight lose. It's awesome.
     
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    #98 runner2009, Jan 26, 2016 at 6:34 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2016
  19. AloeSvea

    AloeSvea Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    As I say - I am very willing to be corrected! But, judging from the promotional material, and the material itself (TV docos, and the book, and the BSD website), and it could be from the producers and publishers - not Mosley himself (although that would take a strange level of passivity on his part in accepting that) - someone is not reporting openly that would clarify the situation, or info about his 'diabetic range' is being misreported. And the misreporting, or misrepresentation could be in order to sell the books.

    One of the posters above says this could be because the TV docos (on fasting and fast exercise) (where he was not presented as diabetic, but as in danger - which I interpreted as borderline prediabetic - still a scary situation as it indicates early signs of insulin resistance), predates the book considerably. I don't understand this timeline, because 'the end point' of those TV progs is that he improved his insulin sensitivity and got out of the danger zone (via IF and HIT). (Hey! I loved those TV programmes! I love the 12 mins of HIT a month idea!) It could be, of course, that he then went on to cross into prediabetes, and then diabetes. But, you see my point here? What then of the methods, if he actually developed full blown diabetes AFTER IFing and fast exercising? something does not add up! My belief is, it is in the reporting of him having reversed his own diabetes. But in order to know this, we really need to know his HBA1c's eh?!

    Others disagree, but I think it does matter (it matters to me anyway!), if he is being presented as having had diabetes, and he was never, truly, in the diabetic range. It does not detract from the wonderfulness of bringing the theories of Fung and Taylor and others to the people! (Which he/it does, I guess, but I have only read the website and seen the TV progs - I'll have to wait awhile for the book to be freed up in the library system!), as very aptly said by a poster above. I think it is probably an issue of publicists allowing a little to go a longer way. (in this case - his insulin resistance lol.) Yes - to increase credibility. To increase revenue.

    I personally think it was unnecessary to fiddle with the truth - it's still a good message and is very accessible in the form it is in.

    But I think honest presentation of the facts in medical journalism in particular, but in all journalism, is something we should be able to take for granted. And currently we can't. Big business. Big monopolies. Etc etc.
     
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  20. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    You may be on to something. For his 5:2 diet books he seems to have said he was pre-diabetic before he did the diet, but now with his new book he is saying the 5:2 diet reversed his type 2 diabetes.
     
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