Have to admit defeat.

PenguinMum · May 16, 2018

Guzzler said:
I will either have to abandon LCHF and see higher numbers or take bg lowering drugs so that I can add carbs to my diet. This is because of weight loss. I have raised the level of fats and protein in my diet and I have started snacking again deliberately to stop weight loss and after weighing myself this evening I see that after three weeks of these raised fats etc I have again lost weight and I am well into the underweight category.

I am way overdue for my A1c. I have been putting it off specifically because I cannot think of a reason not to be weighed, however, I am always weighed as part of the checks I have for my primary condition so eventually something will be said.

My question is, gun to head, which drugs should I be researching? I would rather not take the class of drugs that squeezes the life out of beta cells.

I am genuinely upset that you are in this situation. You are among a handful of people I folllw and admire on the forum and as a rookie you have always given me great advice. The only thing I can say is when I embraced LCHF shortly afyer diagnosis 6 months ago I rejected medication (my HBA1c was 53 so not drastic though I didnt know that at the time) but I have always felt at the backof my mind that I might need to rethink my management esp meds as I progress. I hope you will find a way that you are happy with. You deserve nothing less. Best wishes.

Alison54321 · May 16, 2018

Guzzler said:
I did not mention insulin in particular. I do not have a problem with injections.

No, I know. I just realised I hadn't

Brunneria said:
Most type 2s start off with insulin resistance - which is known to cause as much (if not more) damage as longterm raised blood glucose levels. Adding medications that raise insulin levels further, => greater insulin resistance => More damage done by high insulin levels.

Of course, that only applies to people with insulin resistance.

If @Guzzler is suffering from low insulin levels, rather than high ones, then supplementing her natural insulin would be a GREAT move.

Yes, in those circumstances in makes sense.

Brunneria · May 16, 2018

lovinglife said:
There is another forum member who has been on it for over 20 years but for the life I can't recall who it is to tag them - hopefully they'll see this or someone else will tag them for me

I think you may mean @Boo1979

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

PenguinMum said:
I am genuinely upset that you are in this situation. You are among a handful of people I folllw and admire on the forum and as a rookie you have always given me great advice. The only thing I can say is when I embraced LCHF shortly afyer diagnosis 6 months ago I rejected medication (my HBA1c was 53 so not drastic though I didnt know that at the time) but I have always felt at the backof my mind that I might need to rethink my management esp meds as I progress. I hope you will find a way that you are happy with. You deserve nothing less. Best wishes.

Thank you, much appreciated.

KK123 · May 16, 2018

Guzzler said:
I am not ashamed, far from it. LCHF has improved my A1c, improved my pain levels and improved my prognosis so I am loathe to abandon it. I have jiggled the carbs but any higher than 50g and my pre/post prandial difference is over 2mmol sometimes a lot more. I am unable to stall this weight loss for more than a couple of weeks and this is affecting me mentally.
My eldest lives a fair distance away so it can be weeks in between seeing him. He came over Easter and immediately raged at me calling me 'cadaverous'. He wants me to stop and I have no good argument against stopping now.

Hi Guzzler, as you know, your son is obviously worried. I too have lost weight (which I can ill afford to lose) by keeping my carbs low and using very small amounts of insulin. This seems to be keeping my levels down but I know I am looking gaunt. I will admit I do get embarrassed when someone hasn't seen me for a while, I am sure they are thinking I have the dreaded 'C' word. I feel great but do not know how to stop losing weight whilst maintaining a low carb diet. I have tried to eat extra cheese and nuts but got told to cut them out because my cholesterol had risen!!! It sometimes seems you can't win and I understand your 'gun to the head' question. I could up my carbs and then keep my bg low by using more insulin but I really don't want to use insulin in that manner as I am of the opinion if I eat fewer carbs it's easier to avoid higher doses. Sorry to ramble, I don't know the answer but if you are very thin then that surely cannot continue. x

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

KK123 said:
Hi Guzzler, as you know, your son is obviously worried. I too have lost weight (which I can ill afford to lose) by keeping my carbs low and using very small amounts of insulin. This seems to be keeping my levels down but I know I am looking gaunt. I will admit I do get embarrassed when someone hasn't seen me for a while, I am sure they are thinking I have the dreaded 'C' word. I feel great but do not know how to stop losing weight whilst maintaining a low carb diet. I have tried to eat extra cheese and nuts but got told to cut them out because my cholesterol had risen!!! It sometimes seems you can't win and I understand your 'gun to the head' question. I could up my carbs and then keep my bg low by using more insulin but I really don't want to use insulin in that manner as I am of the opinion if I eat fewer carbs it's easier to avoid higher doses. Sorry to ramble, I don't know the answer but if you are very thin then that surely cannot continue. x

I am lucky in that the 'C' word (Cholesterol, that is!) doesn't bother me one whit.

Rachox · May 16, 2018

Sorry to hear about your dilemma @Guzzler, your profile says you take Metformin, this may be asking the obvious but are you on maximum dose of that?

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

Rachox said:
Sorry to hear about your dilemma @Guzzler, your profile says you take Metformin, this may be asking the obvious but are you on maximum dose of that?

I was on four per day, yes, then dropped to three when I got an A1c of 43.

Rachox · May 16, 2018

Guzzler said:
I was on four per day, yes, then dropped to three when I got an A1c of 43.

Maybe the first step could be to increase it back to 4 before adding in another drug?

lovinglife · May 16, 2018

Brunneria said:
I think you may mean @Boo1979

Thanks I think your right

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

Rachox said:
Maybe the first step could be to increase it back to 4 before adding in another drug?

I really do not think that would be sufficient to aid weight gain. I lost a lot of weight (comparatively, for me) when I was on the full dose. The loss slowed right down after the dose was cut, this may have been coincidence, though.

Metabolism_Boss · May 16, 2018

Guzzler said:
I was on four per day, yes, then dropped to three when I got an A1c of 43.

Very sorry to hear that you are having to reconsider a diet that has suited you well. I hope you are able to find a way forward and that your practice staff will be able to assist.

DCUKMod · May 16, 2018

@Guzzler - I'm sorry you're really struggling with this. I'm very slight, and am constantly managing my weight to keep it up, but I seem to have managed to to that now generally, although just the other day I decided to wear a pair of summer trousers I hadn't work since last year, and whilst my weight is relatively stable, my waist has obviously reduced.

In terms of meds,I attended a presentation a couple of months ago where an Endo stated that there are now over 400 potential combinations of med combinations for the treatment of T2. Of course, that's 400 combinations, not 400 different drugs, so there's a long way to go from Metformin alone.

Secondly, when you go for your HbA1c, would you consider having your thyroid checked? If your thyroid goes a bit dickie, you can lose weight without trying. Why npot ask if they'll do a good, wide bloods panel for you, just to ensure there's nothing that's influencing your weightloss.

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

I feel that I must clarify things a little. When I say I must admit defeat it is not that I think being on bg lowering drugs is a failure of some kind. The defeat only speaks to the weight loss.

With this in mind, I must say that as a sufferer of chronic pain LCHF has had actually seen a reduction in my pain levels which has improved my quality of life and restored a modicum of independence. I am reluctant to add carbs back into my diet for this reason as well as the risks involved with higher bg levels.

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

Metabolism_Boss said:
Very sorry to hear that you are having to reconsider a diet that has suited you well. I hope you are able to find a way forward and that your practice staff will be able to assist.

Thank you.

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

DCUKMod said:
@Guzzler - I'm sorry you're really struggling with this. I'm very slight, and am constantly managing my weight to keep it up, but I seem to have managed to to that now generally, although just the other day I decided to wear a pair of summer trousers I hadn't work since last year, and whilst my weight is relatively stable, my waist has obviously reduced.

In terms of meds,I attended a presentation a couple of months ago where an Endo stated that there are now over 400 potential combinations of med combinations for the treatment of T2. Of course, that's 400 combinations, not 400 different drugs, so there's a long way to go from Metformin alone.

Secondly, when you go for your HbA1c, would you consider having your thyroid checked? If your thyroid goes a bit dickie, you can lose weight without trying. Why npot ask if they'll do a good, wide bloods panel for you, just to ensure there's nothing that's influencing your weightloss.

The thyroid tests would be a good idea. Thank you.

Alison54321 · May 16, 2018

I'm interested by what you should do, so had a google. In some ways this is more success than defeat, the LCHF diet has been extremely successful.

Would a combination of metfornim and insulin work? Presumably that would dependent on how insulin resistant you are.

Mr_Pot · May 16, 2018

Hi @Guzzler, I know that calories are thought by many on here to be a poor indicator of weight gain. However, just to give some context to your problem are you able to say approximately how many calories a day you consume?

lucylocket61 · May 16, 2018

May i suggest going back to your doctor about your weight loss? sometimes it isnt diabetes related. It could be many things, and worth exploring maybe?

best wishes in finding a workable solution.

Guzzler · May 16, 2018

Mr_Pot said:
Hi @Guzzler, I know that calories are thought by many on here to be a poor indicator of weight gain. However, just to give some context to your problem are you able to say approximately how many calories a day you consume?

Sorry, I've never counted a calorie in my life. But for context, by reading other peoples comments my level of fat intake is very high e.g members say they have a couple of desertspoons of Fage with a few berries, I have half a bowlful!

Edit for clarity, that's half a bowlful of Fage not half a bowlful of berries, I will have 2-3 strawberries mixed in.

Have to admit defeat.

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