Is diabetes a Cardiovascular disease?

[jarboy]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

 

[GrantGam]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

No. But diabetes can certainly cause CVD.

 

[Resurgam]

Oh those nurses - they do tell us such stories.
All total bunkum.
What they never seem to tell is the one about the diabetics who chose to eat the right foods and live happily ever after, they seem to think that is too much of a fairy story.

 

[Liam1955]

@jarboy - when you see the Diabetic Nurse and she starts telling you stuff - just nod, say the occasional yes and oh really.
If in doubt about 'anything'? This Forum is the Best place to ask for advice.

 

[Daibell]

Hi. Try to avoid this nurse in the future as she obviously hasn't a clue. Diabetes is a condition where the body is unable to metabolise glucose properly. In some ways it's that simple and in others ways it can lead to endless problems if not managed of which CVD is just one and only if the diabetes isn't managed.

 

[Deleted Account]

My understanding is that diabetes is NOT a cardiovascular disease but having diabetes can increase the chances of CVD.
I think there have been some studies which show good BG control can reduce the chances of complications such as this.

In my mind, I have diabetes now and I can do nothing about that (some people talk about "reversing type 2" but this is not possible with type 1) but I can manage the condition: exercise, eat healthily, avoid high BG, ...

 

[badcat]

Its an endocrine and (in the case of T1 ) an auto immune disorder that raises CV risk

 

[bulkbiker]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

Time to look for a new nurse if that's what she said.. ridiculous nonsense.

 

[Pinkorchid]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

What she probably meant was that diabetes can put us more at risk to cardiovascular disease

 

[kokhongw]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

Yes. It is closely linked. The higher our HbA1c, the more likely we will experience CVD events. More so than if we have high LDL. That is the one key reason why the low carb advocates suggest that we focus on lowering HbA1c and ignore the resulting higher LDL and statin recommendation.

http://slideplayer.com/slide/5895554/

 

[jarboy]

Thank you for all your replies. Maybe I misheard (but I was taking notes). That's what I thought - diabetes can lead to CVD.

I have a Hba1c of 66. I was offered tablets or diet/exercise to bring that number down. I want to try diet/exercie. I was told that was OK, but if my next hba1c test, in 3 months, is above 48 I will have to take tablets.

I guess if it's 49 we can negotiate.

Thanks again for your help. I have found this web site a forum a god send in terms of information. The nurse was friendly enough and made referrals for DESMOND and retinopathy and the foot thing, so I guess that's the most they can do in the time they have available.

 

[kokhongw]

Thank you for all your replies. Maybe I misheard (but I was taking notes). That's what I thought - diabetes can lead to CVD.

Do have a quick read, type 2 diabetes is about chronically high level of insulin, not just glucose...
http://denversdietdoctor.com/diabetes-vascular-disease-joseph-r-kraft-md/

Getting back to our discussion about vascular disease (atherosclerosis), Kraft noted that those with vascular disease, all of them, had hyperinsulinemia, and Kraft concluded that any and all patients with vascular disease if tested properly would fail miserably. He also suspected that those testing normal via his test would likely be free of vascular disease.

And these slides
https://www.slideshare.net/ivorcummins/doctor-joseph-kraft-interview-slides-father-of-insulin-assay

 

[CherryAA]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

Welcome,

I would put things slightly differently.

I would say that both diabetes (edited to make clear I mean Type 2 diabetes as per the OP) and cardiovascular disease are a consequence of high insulin. Diabetes shows up when the levels of high insulin have caused so much insulin resistance that you can no longer control your blood sugars with it.

If you don't ask your body to create much insulin by using a low carb diet, then you can probably fcontrol your diabetes via diet, you will also be improving your chances contracting lots of other diseases of which CVD is just one.

In the end it doesn't matter too much how you characterise it. if you want to be healthier and fix your diabetes. look to fix your diet with for example the low carb program here and things should start to get better quickly.

Also, WHEN you go onto medication and IF you do, is your choice not theirs. You can make your own decision about what to do when you see how your Hba1C responds to the diet.

In my own case I started off at 90 in August, by December I had brought it down to 64 and my doctor stopped talking about drugs its 42 now. I would still like to get it down further but not by drugs.

 

[himtoo]

Welcome,

I would put things slightly differently.

I would say that both diabetes and cardiovascular disease are a consequence of high insulin. Diabetes shows up when the levels of high insulin have caused so much insulin resistance that you can no longer control your blood sugars with it.

If you don't ask your body to create much insulin by using a low carb diet, then you can probably fcontrol your diabetes via diet, you will also be improving your chances contracting lots of other diseases of which CVD is just one.

In the end it doesn't matter too much how you characterise it. if you want to be healthier and fix your diabetes. look to fix your diet with for example the low carb program here and things should start to get better quickly.

Also, WHEN you go onto medication and IF you do, is your choice not theirs. You can make your own decision about what to do when you see how your Hba1C responds to the diet.

In my own case I started off at 90 in August, by December I had brought it down to 64 and my doctor stopped talking about drugs its 42 now. I would still like to get it down further but not by drugs.

you might want to qualify your wider than a mile broad generalisation.

The exact cause of type 1 diabetes is unknown. But in most people with type 1 diabetes, the body's immune system — which normally fights harmful bacteria and viruses — mistakenly destroys insulin-producing (islet) cells in the pancreas. Genetics and environmental factors appear to play a role in this process.( viruses are thought to be a key player in type 1 )

I was diagnosed type 1 in 1972 in a family with no previous history of Diabetes. Furthermore -- in 1972 -- processed foods as we know them had not been invented yet -- I grew up on a diet of meat ( or fish ), boiled or mashed potato , and 3 veg ( think broccoli , cauli , carrots , green beans , peas .
breakfasts were normally a ( lowish carb) fry up - eggs , bacon , mushrooms , tomato and a piece of toast.

your post is misleading to some , helpful to some , but not fully accurate.

 

[catapillar]

I would think of diabetes as a vascular disease (rather than a cardio vascular disease) because high blood sugar makes the blood more viscious and when thick sticky blood is trying to force its way through tiny delicate veins it causes damage to those tiny veins (retinopathy/ nephropathy) or the blood can't actually get along the veins as well as it should (peripheral neurology).

But the vascular disease - ie blood not being able to get round the veins - is the outcome from the condition of diabetes. Diabetes isn't really, technically, itself a vascular disease, it just causes vascular diseases.

 

[Guzzler]

Some DNs seem to be on the ball regarding Diabetes, others, not so much. This is evident by the questions asked and anecdotes told of the information given by DNs. The best people to ask about a particular type of Diabetes are those whose experience with their Diabetes has led them to read and research and live with their condition on a daily basis.
I dislike scare tactics but what is more frightening is that there are a few DNs out there who have a very poor knowledge base of their subject. For example, I was prescribed Metformin at diagnosis, four months later I asked about the VitB12 X Metformin.
I was met by a blank stare and then asked what I wanted to know. She obviously had no idea about the link but my point is the subsequent link to neuropathy. She eventually told me to ask the GP! She is a specialist nurse, she should have known this.
She is allowed to prescribe drugs but is she not required to understand the risks of said drugs?
I'm so glad I found this site, it taught me what questions to ask.

 

[Biggles2]

I was diagnosed 3 weeks ago as being type 2 diabetic. I've just been to see the diabetic nurse and she told me that diabetes is a cardiovascular disease.

I've devoured pages on this web site since my diagnosis but I cannot find anywhere that says that. Is it true?

Heart Disease can be a complication of both Type 1 and Type 2 Diabetes:
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes-complications/heart-disease.html

 

[ickihun]

I was told in 2002 that uncontrolled diabetes can cause complications and hardening of arteries is one of them. A lot has changed since 2002 but I now have atherosclerosis but not sure how long I've had it. No one does.
Not everyone develops it. I believe due to family being predisposed.
None diabetics can get it too!

 

[bulkbiker]

you might want to qualify your wider than a mile broad generalisation.

The exact cause of type 1 diabetes is unknown. But in most people with type 1 diabetes, the body's immune system — which normally fights harmful bacteria and viruses — mistakenly destroys insulin-producing (islet) cells in the pancreas. Genetics and environmental factors appear to play a role in this process.( viruses are thought to be a key player in type 1 )

I was diagnosed type 1 in 1972 in a family with no previous history of Diabetes. Furthermore -- in 1972 -- processed foods as we know them had not been invented yet -- I grew up on a diet of meat ( or fish ), boiled or mashed potato , and 3 veg ( think broccoli , cauli , carrots , green beans , peas .
breakfasts were normally a ( lowish carb) fry up - eggs , bacon , mushrooms , tomato and a piece of toast.

your post is misleading to some , helpful to some , but not fully accurate.

Rather harsh ... @CherryAA was replying to a newly diagnosed Type 2.. and I assume (hopefully correctly) that she was explaining her thoughts on the causes of Type 2. Yes Type 1 is a totally different condition and is caused by something that none of us knows. It is common on this forum (unfortunately sometimes I will agree) that we talk about "diabetes" relying on the context to reveal the type. This is not always helpful but in this case I think most of us can see where she was coming from.

 

[CherryAA]

Rather harsh ... @CherryAA was replying to a newly diagnosed Type 2.. and I assume (hopefully correctly) that she was explaining her thoughts on the causes of Type 2. Yes Type 1 is a totally different condition and is caused by something that none of us knows. It is common on this forum (unfortunately sometimes I will agree) that we talk about "diabetes" relying on the context to reveal the type. This is not always helpful but in this case I think most of us can see where she was coming from.

Totally true . - yep the poster had stated he was type 2 and talked about the link between CVD and Type 2 hence my response that I think the two are connected but not necessarily because either causes the other.

The poster's medical professional had said that type 2 was a cardiovascular disease, whilst that does not appear to be true, I can understand why she might make such a statement erroneuosly, simply because there is a lot of evidence linking the two, hence linking the two in my response.