Low carb has shot up my cholesterol

[Alexandra100]

I do not eat the fat off meat as when I was in the hospital after a heart attack, every single person on the same ward as I were Asians like Pakistan etc. Now they eat a lot of fats and ghee that is their main diet, yet they all had a Heart Attack and had high cholesterol..Considering their diet is probably more natural than the British diet meaning they eat meats and cook with a lot of Ghee and cream this does play on my mind. I will eat butter and have cream but not to much of it. There diet is very high in fat

Also in white rice and on festive occasions sweets. Also muslims fast for Ramadan, which involves no food OR DRINK during the hours of daylight, combined often with stuffing before dawn and after sunset in order to stoke up for the day's fast. Many sikhs and hindus are vegetarian, so will not be eating meat fat, though they will of course be cooking with ghee. As a vegetarian I hold no brief for meat fat, just saying...!

 

[librarising]

OK I give in - what is MDI? Do you get it from Ikea?

Are you referring to my signature ?
Multiple Daily Injections (of insulin). 1 (or 2 i.e. split) of basal. 3 x bolus daily with meals.
It's a self-assembly approach to controlling diabetes but usually comes with full instructions
Geoff

 

[Pinkorchid]

People with high cholesterol may be interested in articles from Heart UK the cholesterol charity

https://heartuk.org.uk/

 

[bulkbiker]

People with high cholesterol may be interested in this article from Heart UK the cholesterol charity

https://heartuk.org.uk/cholesterol-...diets-and-foods/saturated-fat-and-cholesterol

Or maybe not.. Are any of those statements supported by evidence?
Just because Heart UK says so doesn't necessarily make it correct..
We ae seeing more and more evidence that
1. Cholesterol is not a "problem" (especially useful as we would die without it)
2. What we know about how cholesterol works is at the moment very limited (and I would go so far as to say that 95% of GP's don't understand it)
3. Cholesterol levels can go up and down during the day like blood sugars so all we ever see on a test is a snapshot of what our levels were at that particular time
4. LDL has been incorrectly labelled as "bad" without much (if any) evidence and it could well be that LDL particle size is important rather than total LDL (which is usually a calculated number anyway)
5. For older women higher cholesterol numbers seem to be protective so artificially lowering it though medication could well be dangerous
6. All the evidence so far for statins being beneficial is either held by the drugs companies that make them and has not been available for review or does not seem to support their "life enhancing" properties much if at all
7. If you are worried about your heart health then try and get a scan that looks at the heart and arteries so you can see if there is anything nasty going on rather than looking at a rather bad proxy (cholesterol)

I don't think that any of that is mentioned on the heartuk.org website although I think it is pretty much the current state of thinking of a lot of cardiologists - Prof Rory Collins aside

but then again I'm no doctor just someone that spends a lot of time (too much maybe) reading about this stuff rather than relying on what I have been told by the powers that be..

 

[Pinkorchid]

[

Just because Heart UK says so doesn't necessarily make it correct..

I don't know if it is right or wrong it is just another view to consider but then that must also go for other things we read that says higher cholesterol is not bad how do we decide what is right or wrong or do we just believe what we want to. As for cholesterol being better for older women is that a study of specifically older women with diabetes or older women without diabetes who are at a lower risk of heart attack and stroke. What is considered a good level for cholesterol before it is classed as being to high there must come a point when it is but that never seems to be said

 

[donnellysdogs]

I have come to the conclusion that some people can eat pasta, rice, potatoes and have no affects through their life of high sugar, yet there are others us who cannot. What foods seem ok for some are not for all

Agree.

Genetics I think plays a big part... my hubby has 3 other siblings.. he and another has thyroid/high cholesterol/high bp. The other two that also look totally different are the opposite and absolutely survive on junky food and cakesbetc...

I do not personally believe that everything is diet alone... and we know that..

In fact is diet alone only contributes to 15% then I can see why alot of people just dont really take much notice of diet..

 

[transiting]

There is one pathway in the liver that does not work for a few people, if the test shows you are one of these people you need to take a spasal statin to keep you alive. (This is normly done by a lipid consultant not a GP.)

Yes - I am being referred to a lipid consultant - bit worrying about the view that I need to take a statin 'to keep me alive'!

 

[derry60]

Also in white rice and on festive occasions sweets. Also muslims fast for Ramadan, which involves no food OR DRINK during the hours of daylight, combined often with stuffing before dawn and after sunset in order to stoke up for the day's fast. Many sikhs and hindus are vegetarian, so will not be eating meat fat, though they will of course be cooking with ghee. As a vegetarian I hold no brief for meat fat, just saying...!

Muslims only fast once a year and also when they do eat during this time this is not recommended for a person with diabetes in general. I would not say that fasting once a year makes a lot of difference, to be honest.

 

[ringi]

The problem with the muslin daytime fasting is that as soon as the sun sets they eat a VERY high carb meal, undoing any benefit of the relativity short daylight fast.

 

[derry60]

Or maybe not.. Are any of those statements supported by evidence?
Just because Heart UK says so doesn't necessarily make it correct..
We ae seeing more and more evidence that
1. Cholesterol is not a "problem" (especially useful as we would die without it)
2. What we know about how cholesterol works is at the moment very limited (and I would go so far as to say that 95% of GP's don't understand it)
3. Cholesterol levels can go up and down during the day like blood sugars so all we ever see on a test is a snapshot of what our levels were at that particular time
4. LDL has been incorrectly labelled as "bad" without much (if any) evidence and it could well be that LDL particle size is important rather than total LDL (which is usually a calculated number anyway)
5. For older women higher cholesterol numbers seem to be protective so artificially lowering it though medication could well be dangerous
6. All the evidence so far for statins being beneficial is either held by the drugs companies that make them and has not been available for review or does not seem to support their "life enhancing" properties much if at all
7. If you are worried about your heart health then try and get a scan that looks at the heart and arteries so you can see if there is anything nasty going on rather than looking at a rather bad proxy (cholesterol)

I don't think that any of that is mentioned on the heartuk.org website although I think it is pretty much the current state of thinking of a lot of cardiologists - Prof Rory Collins aside

but then again I'm no doctor just someone that spends a lot of time (too much maybe) reading about this stuff rather than relying on what I have been told by the powers that be..

I can see what you are saying but many of studies that I am reading with all of this is the words "could, possibly, may, More words of "Could be dangerous" none seem to set any of it in stone regarding Cholesterol. I also notice when logging onto this site that we get news feeds, like one was where it said that people with heart disease are more likely to die 7 fold if they have diabetes" When you click into it the words "May, Possibly, could" This I am finding scaremongering. Another one was telling people that being on medication could kill a person rather than lowering their sugar naturally. This I find upsetting also. So I am looking for something concrete regarding Cholesterol

 

[derry60]

The problem with the muslin daytime fasting is that as soon as the sun sets they eat a VERY high carb meal, undoing any benefit of the relativity short daylight fast.

Exactly they are probably doing more damage to be honest

 

[derry60]

Yes - I am being referred to a lipid consultant - bit worrying about the view that I need to take a statin 'to keep me alive'!

I am on Statins and have been for years but |I had a heart attack 14 years ago. If you have not had a heart attack maybe lower your cholesterol naturally, some people can't hence that is why some take Statins. There are some who have horrible affects from taking them. I, on the other hand, have been fine as of yet

 

[lucylocket61]

I wonder if people with diabetes are more sensitive to cholesterol or more prone to heart problems, so the advice for the general public needs to be tweaked for us?

 

[bulkbiker]

I can see what you are saying but many of studies that I am reading with all of this is the words "could, possibly, may, More words of "Could be dangerous" none seem to set any of it in stone regarding Cholesterol. I also notice when logging onto this site that we get news feeds, like one was where it said that people with heart disease are more likely to die 7 fold if they have diabetes" When you click into it the words "May, Possibly, could" This I am finding scaremongering. Another one was telling people that being on medication could kill a person rather than lowering their sugar naturally. This I find upsetting also. So I am looking for something concrete regarding Cholesterol

Unless you are prepared to lock people into a room and manage precisely what they consume for years and years you are very unlikely to get concrete evidence of anything to do with human nutrition. This has been done a couple of times but not for long enough to come up with anything to do with cholesterol so far as I can discover. I'm afraid it will all be "could" and "would' and "may".

Various recent studies of studies, "PURE" is one of them, have possibly demonstrated that sat fats are not bad for us at all. This was what we were posting in the video of Prof Salim Yusuf about 6 months ago when he released the results in a talk he gave. As the outgoing president of the World Heart Federation his words had some weight and when he confirmed what common sense tells us is likely then I for one am more convinced than by older studies that have been fairly roundly debunked.

However even the PURE study is not definitive as it is another meta study of observational studies which all have a fairly weak scientific background. So I'm afraid as always you pays yer money...

I try to use logic and experience and look at contributing factors. For me cholesterol is not the enemy and neither are saturated fats but no-one can say that for sure. I am however prepared to not be afraid of them and have had the CAC scan to show my heart health is ok if not great for my age and background and dietary history. I'd far rather believe that than the hysteria around statins and cholesterol causing heart disease that a lot of misinformed doctors seem happy to propagate.

 

[bulkbiker]

I wonder if people with diabetes are more sensitive to cholesterol or more prone to heart problems, so the advice for the general public needs to be tweaked for us?

I think that may be true of those with poorly controlled blood sugar levels like the poor souls following the Eatwell guidelines. If you have non diabetic HbA1c then where lies the problem?

 

[ringi]

Yes - I am being referred to a lipid consultant - bit worrying about the view that I need to take a statin 'to keep me alive'!

I had very high trigs, so was sent to the lipid consultant about this, I then discovered "low carb" and got a new set of blood tests done before seeing the consultant. So when I saw the lipid consultant my trigs were normal, the lipid consultant approved of the results of a low carb diet, so now on my GP records is a letter from the lipid consultant saying I should keep to a low carb diet. (As I have had no reasons to see a GP since I don't know what the GP thinks of this....)

There is a very quick check the lipid consultant will do to see if its possible for you to have this gene and if so they will get the very expensive blood test done. familial lipid disorder is very uncommon hence a GP does not have the experience to check if you are at real risk of having it.

 

[lucylocket61]

I think that may be true of those with poorly controlled blood sugar levels like the poor souls following the Eatwell guidelines. If you have non diabetic HbA1c then where lies the problem?

I suppose I am a bit worried that a normal HbA1c is only part of the issue, and there may be other issues we either dont yet know about, or I dont yet know about.

I only eat olive oil, butter, lard, goose fat as the fats part of my diet. I dont eat extra fat on purpose. I eat whole fat stuff, no low-fat stuff. I hope that is enough to keep me healthy. I wont get my cholesterol results for three weeks, and then it is only the total. Is there a way of getting a breakdown done privately? I am on benefits, so cost is an issue here.

 

[bulkbiker]

I suppose I am a bit worried that a normal HbA1c is only part of the issue, and there may be other issues we either dont yet know about, or I dont yet know about.

I only eat olive oil, butter, lard, goose fat as the fats part of my diet. I dont eat extra fat on purpose. I eat whole fat stuff, no low-fat stuff. I hope that is enough to keep me healthy. I wont get my cholesterol results for three weeks, and then it is only the total. Is there a way of getting a breakdown done privately? I am on benefits, so cost is an issue here.

Well I'd wait and see what results you get first. It is possible to get a full lipid panel done privately but it costs about £40.00 minimum so not exactly cheap plus you'd need to get the blood drawn somewhere too which I'm afraid may also have a cost attached.

 

[ringi]

I wonder if people with diabetes are more sensitive to cholesterol or more prone to heart problems, so the advice for the general public needs to be tweaked for us?

The current thinking from the group of experts I trust is that a high insulin level is what puts us at a greater risk of heart problems and that it has nothing to do with blood glucose levels. They believe the high insulin level is due to a combination of insulin resistance and a diet with more carbs then the person's body can cope with.

We all know that insulin resistance plus carbs put people at great risk of Type2. Hence Type2 shows up in the data as being related to lots of heart problems.

Therefore if these experts are correct (and I believe they are) to greatly reduce the risk of heart problems, we need to be eating very few carbs.

 

[Alexandra100]

Muslims only fast once a year and also when they do eat during this time this is not recommended for a person with diabetes in general. I would not say that fasting once a year makes a lot of difference, to be honest.

Although people with health problems are excused from the muslim fast, in reality they are often reluctant to exclude themselves from this group religious actvity.