Low carb, keto for children

[IanD]

Ok, if that is what we are talking about here and it was my child, then I would want medical professionals involved and not strangers on an internet forum!

Trouble is, the medical professionals prescribe epilim. A keto diet is no danger to health - & obviously we will watch her carefully & adapt as necessary.

e,g, In their rejection of a low carb diet, the DUKs warn against constipation. Such a condition is readily corrected by diet adjustment, without increasing carbs.

I followed the medical professionals - Dr & DUK/NHS - diet very carefully, reinforced by the local dietitian. They did warn me that diabetes was progressive - don't think you've failed when you get worse. In 8 years I was crippled with neuropathy. Dr suggested hospital investigation. This forum advised low carb & in 3 months I was out of pain & playing tennis again. TEN years ago. Still free of diabetes symptoms, still playing tennis at 78.

Much better to follow the advice of people who HAVE triumphed over their condition.

 

[IanD]

@IanD - For some reason I recall you being a member of The Public Health Collaboration?

At the 2016 Conference in Birmingham, there were a decent number of HCPs there; specialist nurses and Dietiticians, dealing with paediatric epilepsy patients. They were very enthusiastic about it.

I seem to recall their enthusiasm about Joanne McCormack's presentation relating to LC for children.

That's right, I'm wearing their shirt in this film.

THanks, I'll follow that up. Actually I went on the expert course after I started low carb - the dietitian recommended it. That was before Dr Deakin started low carb herself, so I wrote to her complaining about the advice regarding fats ... the rest is history. I've had a fair amount of correspondence with Sam at PHC, though they've never come near enough to meet.

 

[DCUKMod]

That's right, I'm wearing their shirt in this film.

THanks, I'll follow that up. Actually I went on the expert course after I started low carb - the dietitian recommended it. That was before Dr Deakin started low carb herself, so I wrote to her complaining about the advice regarding fats ... the rest is history. I've had a fair amount of correspondence with Sam at PHC, though they've never come near enough to meet.

Perhaps drop Sam and email and see if he knows of any of the keto supporting HCPs, working in paediatric epilepsy near where you'll be.

 

[notafanofsugar]

Great Facebook group run by a mum here: https://m.facebook.com/?_rdr#~!/profile.php?id=162664904247990&ref=content_filter

 

[Kailee56]

Epileptic children benefitting from Ketogenic diet

Largest group was 2-6 year olds in this study
http://www.gutbrainaxis.org/pdf/cross paper KD vs AEDs.pdf

A review of multiple studies showing refractory epileptic children benefit from Ketogenic diet
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/b2ff/be7088098be1ffb9396d96490c6e3ea2f91e.pdf

Study with 150 epileptic children, mean age 5.3 years old
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/102/6/1358.short

As a Ketogenic author and health consultant, Maria Emmerich wrote this on her blog:
“Our sons Micah and Kai spent their first years (2 for Micah, 1 for Kai) in a nutritionally limited environment (orphanage in Ethiopia). The caregivers there did the best they could with the resources they had but in a country with over 2 million orphans under the age of 18, this is a challenge. When we brought Micah and Kai home they didn’t even register on the height weight charts (1% or less). We immediately started them on the same diet that we ate (a well formulated ketogenic diet). The only change is they had a more traditional 3 meals a day for their growing bodies.

Within 1 year on this well formulated ketogenic diet our sons had caught up to about 50% on the height weight charts. In 2 years they were 50-75%. They now grow like weeds and thrive.” – Craig and Maria Emmerich”

The last half of this talks about a Ketogenic diet for healthy children. Interesting, someone sited the same article as a negative for raising children on a Ketogenic diet. The same person who said this diet would interfere with normal socialization of children.
https://www.perfectketo.com/ketosis-for-children/

WARNING: Snarky comments below

PS. When someone implies children on a Ketogenic diet will become socially stunted because they do not eat all the sugar and junk food their friends eat, I can think of 2 responses.
1. What if the child was diabetic, which they probably will be if they continue to eat junk food? Are you saying diabetic children are socially stunted? Do you really want to go there?
2. As my father said : So, if all your friends decide to jump off a cliff, are you going to jump too? Just because the majority does something does not mean it is the best or even a good thing to do.

 

[Kailee56]

One more source, The Charlie Foundation.
https://charliefoundation.org/

Their story:
In 1993, 11 month old Charlie Abrahams developed difficult to control epilepsy. As a last resort, while Charlie was experiencing multiple daily seizures and multiple daily medications, his parents turned to a Ketogenic Diet for help. The diet worked. Charlie became seizure and drug free within a month. He was on the diet for five years and now eats whatever he wants. He has never had another seizure.

The Charlie Foundation for Ketogenic Therapies was founded in 1994 to provide information about diet therapies for people with epilepsy, other neurological disorders and select cancers. Charlie Abrahams, pictured above, continues to be the inspiration for the foundation, working as a pre-school teacher, and proving that Epilepsy can be cured through Ketogenic Therapy

In recent years, less restrictive versions of the Ketogenic Diet have been developed making it accessible to a larger segment of the epilepsy population (estimated at over 60 million people worldwide). Today there are over 200 hospitals worldwide with Ketogenic Diet programs. In the USA, advanced-level epilepsy treatment centers are required to provide Ketogenic Diet therapy

 

[CathP]

I’ve no experience of epilepsy and a Keto diet, but just to reassure you that my now 7 year old type 1 daughter has been low carbing happily for the past 2 years, without physical or psychological harm!

 

[wiflib]

Epileptic children benefitting from Ketogenic diet

Largest group was 2-6 year olds in this study
http://www.gutbrainaxis.org/pdf/cross paper KD vs AEDs.pdf

A review of multiple studies showing refractory epileptic children benefit from Ketogenic diet
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/b2ff/be7088098be1ffb9396d96490c6e3ea2f91e.pdf

Study with 150 epileptic children, mean age 5.3 years old
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/102/6/1358.short

As a Ketogenic author and health consultant, Maria Emmerich wrote this on her blog:
“Our sons Micah and Kai spent their first years (2 for Micah, 1 for Kai) in a nutritionally limited environment (orphanage in Ethiopia). The caregivers there did the best they could with the resources they had but in a country with over 2 million orphans under the age of 18, this is a challenge. When we brought Micah and Kai home they didn’t even register on the height weight charts (1% or less). We immediately started them on the same diet that we ate (a well formulated ketogenic diet). The only change is they had a more traditional 3 meals a day for their growing bodies.

Within 1 year on this well formulated ketogenic diet our sons had caught up to about 50% on the height weight charts. In 2 years they were 50-75%. They now grow like weeds and thrive.” – Craig and Maria Emmerich”

The last half of this talks about a Ketogenic diet for healthy children. Interesting, someone sited the same article as a negative for raising children on a Ketogenic diet. The same person who said this diet would interfere with normal socialization of children.
https://www.perfectketo.com/ketosis-for-children/

WARNING: Snarky comments below

PS. When someone implies children on a Ketogenic diet will become socially stunted because they do not eat all the sugar and junk food their friends eat, I can think of 2 responses.
1. What if the child was diabetic, which they probably will be if they continue to eat junk food? Are you saying diabetic children are socially stunted? Do you really want to go there?
2. As my father said : So, if all your friends decide to jump off a cliff, are you going to jump too? Just because the majority does something does not mean it is the best or even a good thing to do.

My dad used the ‘head in the fire’ line. I understood.

 

[Robbiebee]

I don't know whether keto diets for kids is good or not, but I am very concerned that kids (or anyone else who eats a keto diet that's put in front of them) eating keto, ie very low carb, high fat, is going to be put at risk of at the very least obesity if they then eat a high carb diet when socialising or eating away from home. It's always been my understanding that as you increase carbs you must compensate by reducing fat. Keto I think is too restrictive for those who don't medically need to be on it to sustain particularly when socialising, as kids do.

 

[DCUKMod]

Hi @IanD - I don't know if you knew it is the Low Carb Breckonridge Conference this weekend.

As you would expect, the speaker list is very interesting indeed, but from your perspective, relating to this thread, the following presentation might be of interest to you:

• Dr Eric Kossoff – “A Century of Progress: Ketogenic Diets for Epilepsy in Children and Adults”

The Conference does offer live internet streaming access, but it's not free. It is $50, for the whole event. Last year quite a number of the LC Breckenridge presentations were uploaded to YouTube over time

The link to the Conference home page is here: https://denversdietdoctor.com/low-carb-breckenridge-2018/

I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

 

[shelley262]

Hi @IanD - I don't know if you knew it is the Low Carb Breckonridge Conference this weekend.

As you would expect, the speaker list is very interesting indeed, but from your perspective, relating to this thread, the following presentation might be of interest to you:

• Dr Eric Kossoff – “A Century of Progress: Ketogenic Diets for Epilepsy in Children and Adults”

The Conference does offer live internet streaming access, but it's not free. It is $50, for the whole event. Last year quite a number of the LC Breckenridge presentations were uploaded to YouTube over time

The link to the Conference home page is here: https://denversdietdoctor.com/low-carb-breckenridge-2018/

I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

You can watch live without charge via dietdoctor site you can join free for one month and provided you cancel won’t have to pay or it’s a monthly charge of about 9 quid I’ve joined for free for a month and am watching bits with interest

 

[DCUKMod]

You can watch live without charge via dietdoctor site you can join free for one month and provided you cancel won’t have to pay or it’s a monthly charge of about 9 quid I’ve joined for free for a month and am watching bits with interest

OOOOhhhhh - Thank you for that Shelley.

 

[eggs11]

Late to the party with this thread - but found it on searching for 'low carb for children' on the forum.

I don't want to give my two teenage boys a keto diet, but I do want to reduce the carbs in their diet as I worry about them heading down the same path as me. I had gestational diabetes, diet controlled, with my eldest. Passed a OGTT in the early weeks of second pregnancy but at 8lbs 13 ounces when he was born I do wonder if there was some insulin resistance there too. Anyway, I know they are statistically much more likely to develop t2 themselves due to the gestational diabetes and my recent t2 diagnosis. I want to do all I can to prevent this, so am looking to make subtle changes that won't in any way be a problem with them but will naturally reduce the large amount of carbs in their diet - they eat a ton of bread, pasta and cereal.

I found this link really useful: https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb-kids. I'm going to make changes gradually - and they won't be drastic - for instance offering eggs for breakfast instead of cereal, babybel cheeses/cashew nuts as snacks and changing pasta meals for chicken/fish options with a few new potatoes and lots of veg. If nothing else I believe these changes will fill them up much better than the starchy options they are used to, and is really just going back to a more traditional way of eating, pre-1980s low fat, high carb advice. So I guess my aim for them is more about removing 'excess of carbs' rather than being really low carb.

 

[kittypoker]

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/epi.12069
Use of the modified Atkins diet for treatment of refractory childhood epilepsy: A randomized controlled trial

I haven't read every word of this study or, to be honest, most words because it's long and beyond my non-scientific intellectual capabilities. But my takeaway was: In this randomized‐controlled trial, the modified Atkins diet was found to be significantly more effective in controlling seizures in children with refractory epilepsy, as compared to the continuation of anticonvulsant drugs alone.

I have no children so can't comment on the social ramifications of restricting carbs, but surely it's better for the child to have a restricted diet than be on drugs for who knows how long. Perhaps a mixture (allowing extra carbs for birthday parties, etc.with anticonvulsives available) could work? Obviously not if the anticonvulsives have a cumulative effect, just wondering.

 

[IanD]

Hi @IanD - I don't know if you knew it is the Low Carb Breckonridge Conference this weekend.

As you would expect, the speaker list is very interesting indeed, but from your perspective, relating to this thread, the following presentation might be of interest to you:

• Dr Eric Kossoff – “A Century of Progress: Ketogenic Diets for Epilepsy in Children and Adults”

The Conference does offer live internet streaming access, but it's not free. It is $50, for the whole event. Last year quite a number of the LC Breckenridge presentations were uploaded to YouTube over time

The link to the Conference home page is here: https://denversdietdoctor.com/low-carb-breckenridge-2018/

I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

Thanks folk - I've been off-line since moving mid Feb so I can catch up now.