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Low Carbs versus NHS recommended diet.

Discussion in 'Ask A Question' started by Inchindown, Dec 12, 2016.

  1. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Oracle

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    Personally I wouldn't describe the 8 week diet as "low carb" just very low calorie.. as such I'm not persuaded of its sustainability.
     
  2. lozzark

    lozzark · Member

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    Hi Inchdown,
    I was diagnosed with T2DM in the year 2000. In that time I have read a huge amount about T2. In 2002 I discovered HFLC/ Atkins. I lost 4 st in as many months on about 100g carbs/day. I kept it off for a long while, but have gained 2 st. over last 6 years. During the last 14 years I've eaten LC to varying degrees and on the whole I can eat to my meter. The NHS dietary advice has no substance in fact, it really doesn't. There is no evidence.
    There is no research that compares a LCHF diet with a NHS recommended diet. I eat to my meter most of the time and it helps to keep my BG lower. I also eat predominantly whole/natural foods, which obviously are going to help manage weight.
     
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  3. pleinster

    pleinster Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Aaaarrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! Yes, the prime minister is a very good example...please don't beat me to death every time I fail to cover all the gender bases!
     
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  4. Jennyjustfeet

    Jennyjustfeet Type 2 · Member

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    my diabetic dietician and nurse recommended a low carb diet no more than 130 g per day. its working blood sugars down and so is my weight
     
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  5. Moosepig

    Moosepig Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Japes, good for you for your regime, and isn't it sad that the medical profession seem to be so brainwashed and tunnel visioned regarding our consumption of carbs. I think its so sad that we have to end up almost deceiving our medical "support" providers - isn't life hard enough without adding deception to the skills we diabetics have to learn! Thank goodness we can support each other on this forum, because it feels like the medical profession are determine to squash the LC movement!!!
     
  6. ChrisR64

    ChrisR64 · Newbie

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    My wife (T2) tries to keep carbs down to around 30g per meal, weight has come down, BG in normal range. All advice given from diabetic nurse was eat high starchy carbs (which send your BG through the roof and keeps it there!) come back and we'll start you on medication, now go away and read this leaflet. There are more people in control by ignoring the advice as per NHS guidelines. "Take a pill" keep the Pharmaceutical companies in business and save the doctors/nurses having to think (keeps the numbers up on patients for allocation of funds so the books balance!).
     
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  7. jgordon5

    jgordon5 · Well-Known Member

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    I did when I was first diagnosed (T1) until I started doing some research myself. I found the NHS recommended diet pretty disastrous for me. I tried doing the pH miracle diet for diabetes, which I think has been discredited, but it did lower the amount of insulin I use by about 50% and that made me feel a lot better. I follow a vegan lifestyle which has helped enormously but it isn't all that low carb. However, I've found that the carbs in vegetables like butternut squash, soy beans and vegetables in general, don't act on BGs in the same way that bread and cereals do, so it's helped me to really level out my BGs. So, basically, I think if I'd followed NHS guidelines, I would not be at all well by now.
     
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  8. walnut_face

    walnut_face Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    As an 8 week diet there is no claim to sustainability @bulkbiker , By being Low Cal it becomes low carb by default, though not low carb by your definition
     
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  9. jgordon5

    jgordon5 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm T1 on a pump with a CGM (self funded) and if I went on NHS advice, I wouldn't be able to function at all. Maybe your guitar buddy would read a book called Sugar Surfing, it's about £6 if you get the pdf or kindle version and the best thing about it is that it frees you from thinking that your doctor or diabetes nurse knows best. Only you can really know how food, lifestyle, insulin etc affect you. I was doing my own thing anyway before I started reading it but the book made me feel completely not guilty about going against medical advice - incidentally it's written by a doctor who is a T1 diabetic. There are also lots of tips about pumping which I found very, very useful. Here's the link to Sugar Surfing https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sugar-Surfing-manage-diabetes-modern-ebook/dp/B017EIX9HG.

    You can get really good control with a pump so I do hope your buddy will break free from having to follow the NHS rules. His consultant sounds very strange. My consultant encourages anything almost that helps you live a better life with diabetes and helps keep your BGs in a good range. He could ask to go to another pump clinic under a different consultant. It's worth checking with diabetes forums on FB to see which is a good clinic/consultant. Also Input Diabetes, which you can find by googling , are very helpful in looking for supportive diabetes teams.
     
  10. I don't know how you can say that with such confidence when you don't know what @Trebor2516 eats. Admittedly, some of the meals suggested on the plan are a bit rich in carbs for me, but they are not compulsory. Personally, I credit people with a bit of common sense and free will to make the best choices within the 800 calorie framework.
     
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  11. douglas99

    douglas99 I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I did the original Newcastle diet, with 800 calories, mostly 'carby' shakes, and then a quick refresher to lose weight before christmas. No issues at all, excellent BG all the way through, and continued to be good after the diet. I am always surprised when people seem to think it's difficult to maintain for a relatively short period of eight weeks.
    Particularly as it is well documented on here for extremely good results.
    As you say, I think we're all reasonably intelligent to be on here in the first place.
     
  12. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Oracle

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    Exactly, so you do it for 8 weeks loose some weight then stop and the weight comes back.. as probably does the Type 2 thus it is not sustainable as a lifestyle. I personally find that LCHF is easily sustainable and so can help control my condition so much better. Thus it has become my new way of life and not my "diet". Even my fat phobic sister asked me for my cauliflower cheese sauce recipe last night as she and her partner liked it so much (cream cheese, double cream and sharp cheddar melted together with maybe some mozzarella).
    Well when the diet came out I read through quite a lot of the recipes and decided that their carb content was not in line with my way of eating. If @Trebor2516 is following the diet then I would assume that he is eating some of these.. and it was a general remark about the diet not his specific meals. As a yoyo dieter of more than 30 years I think I can say that for me (and that is the position I always speak from) low calorie diets don't work .. if you don't like my opinion then fine...
     
  13. douglas99

    douglas99 I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Very easily sustainable.
    Lose the weight, eat a balanced diet, if the weight keeps going down, eat a bit more.
    If the weight goes up, eat a bit less.
    If you decide to eat too much, just trim the weight back down by a few weeks of 800 calories again.

    BG stays good, but if by chance you hit the tipping point, it's very simple to get back under it again.
    No need to worry about what you are eating most of the time, so long as the quantity is right.

    Not everyone fails at diets, those on this site have the qualities that made them decide to come here in the first place. I suppose it depends on what you see as being sustainable for you, as you say.
     
  14. lozzark

    lozzark · Member

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    4L of water is excessive. In general it should be 1.9L INCLUDING water from food other fluid and water made by internal metabolism. Drink too much and it flushes out some water soluble nutrients. However, it is much complicated than that see http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-l...althy-eating/in-depth/water/art-20044256?pg=2
     
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  15. Jay-Marc

    Jay-Marc Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    The "official" UK view on 'Carbohydrates and Health' from the Scientific Advisory Committee on Nutrition last year is here.

    In particular:
    This is for the general population - it makes no special consideration of people already with diabetes. There is a fairly extensive meta study of evidence relating to whether carb intakes of various kinds heightens the risk of type 2 diabetes developing - with the conclusion that there was only some evidence related to higher intake of sugars-sweetened beverages.

    Extrapolating this diet as optimal or even suitable for people with diabetes is not supported by evidence or scope within it but it seems to be misused in that way.

    SACN are currently looking at saturated fats and vitamin D.
     
  16. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    There's not much evidence that a 50% carb diet low in saturated fats is optimal or suitable for anyone.
     
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  17. Jay-Marc

    Jay-Marc Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    You may have noticed that this report actually increased marginally the suggested carb component - and I am not referring to the fibre.
     
  18. Japes

    Japes LADA · Well-Known Member

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    Fortunately this student is in my workplace on a placement (there's quite a medical side to the work I do in education) and the subject only came up because she saw me doing my lunch time check. If she ever turns up in my surgery or as a health care professional in the future, I doubt I'd take her advice seriously.
     
  19. Jaylee

    Jaylee Type 1 · Moderator
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    Actually.. (With respect.) reading @Oldvatr 's account on his T1 friend.. I can get where it's coming from.. @Oldvatr 's mate just can't adapt.
    I've been in a band also with a pumper that was a T1 for as long as I have been.. He didn't have a clue. (Set in his ways.) being given a pump don't mean one has perfected the "dark art"... After giving the guy many chances. (& the "science" with detailed excuses for him with the other band members.) I had to let the bass player go after an "insight" on the making of excuses/covering for him for 3 years.. The guy was all over the place blood wise.
    I was always led to believe one had to be "a good diabetic" to get a pump. (We're talking kidney transplant in my ex bassist.) But this guy was still a liability as a D & as a "professional" musician.... I'm a patient guy. But I gave up on him in the end.... :banghead:
     
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    #99 Jaylee, Dec 14, 2016 at 11:58 PM
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
  20. azure

    azure Type 1 · Expert

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    Yes, but that wasn't the main point that struck me. It was the allegation that his consultant had told him to,eat 750g carbs a day and calculate his bolus by counting calories!!!

    And the fact that he was using correction doses of insulin for low blood sugar!

    As @tim2000s says, if that's true, it needs reporting.
     
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