low fat diets make you mentally more unstable

[Ka-Mon]

How do you eat a low-carb, low-fat diet without reducing your calories to a 'starvation' level of 1200 calories or less. I can maintain my weight on 1000 calories a day - following the healthy eating guidelines. I'm eating low carb - still having some problems in losing weight - but don't see how I can keep it low fat. I'm eating mainly meat, fish, cheese and eggs - all of which are pretty high fat - which is why I say I'm eating high fat(ish) - I must be. How do you keep the carbs down without upping your fat levels?

Cheers
Ailz

Many low-carbers report the same problem, how comes? I can only think of two possible answers to that question.

Either:
1) They do not keep to the strict low-carb guide lines as supposed to (in other words they cheat behind the scenes)

or

2) too much fat is stopping them losing weight.

If there is another answer, I'd be happy to hear it.

I am now on around 120-150 carbs a day and low-fat, have lost two stones, down to 11 and because I have reached my optimal BMI I have to eat a little more to maintain my weight so I don't disappear, that can't be bad can it?

 

[millymole]

Well Ka-Mon yet more prejudice from you. Just because I know how to post, could this maybe due to the fact that I am "computer savvy"?
Thought from my registration date its obvious that I am a newbie or newcomer? What kind of argument is this, are newbies not permitted to post any links?
Mod edit: off topic
Can we all now please get back to discussing the topic that this thread is all about, preferably without irrelevant comments from mod edit: personal comment. Thanks.

 

[Ka-Mon]

Well Ka-Mon yet more prejudice from you. Just because I know how to post, could this maybe due to the fact that I am "computer savvy"?

"Computer savvy" does not mean that you know exactly what to do in forums unless you have had experience in in using forums, same as any other software really.

Thought from my registration date its obvious that I am a newbie or newcomer?

Doesn't mean nothing at all, you could have gained experience in others forums or even in this one under a different name. NOTE: I said could have, don't take that to mean that I am implying you have.

What kind of argument is this, are newbies not permitted to post any links?

In some forums "newbies" are only allowed to post links after they have posted a certain amount of comments, not before.

mod edit: off topic

So, your sarcasm was deliberate to draw more attention to yourself than. :roll:

mod edit: off topic

Are you saying that the insulting title of your thread against those who do not eat loads of fat is "justified"? Hmmmm...you don't need a bigger shovel than. :roll:

Can we all now please get back to discussing the topic that this thread is all about, preferably without irrelevant comments from mod edit: personal comment. Thanks.

We are discussing the topic of the thread and letting you know that we find it very insulting and very distasteful for a "newbie". :roll:

 

[millymole]

Ka-Mon you are perfectly entitled to your opinion. Now but it out, your arguments point in the direction of mod edit: personal comment. Take a get deep breaths and relax. I won't respond to your mod edit: personal comment anymore, a bot tedious with someone obsessed with nit picking and insistent on knowing things beforehand. Of course I am a troublemaker of course I registered only to upset as many fellow diabetic as possible of course I am registered with just about any forum there is out there of course whatever you say you are right.
Are you happy now? can the rest of us now parade continue to debate the issue of fat affecting mental health?

 

[Ka-Mon]

Ka-Mon you are perfectly entitled to your opinion. Now but it out, your arguments point in the direction of mod edit: personal comment. Take a get deep breaths and relax. I won't respond to your mod edit: personal comment anymore, a bot tedious with someone obsessed with nit picking and insistent on knowing things beforehand. Of course I am a troublemaker of course I registered only to upset as many fellow diabetic as possible of course I am registered with just about any forum there is out there of course whatever you say you are right.
Are you happy now? can the rest of us now parade continue to debate the issue of fat affecting mental health?

Please do, don't let me stop you and if I have anything else to say I hope you don't mind me joining in...after all, this is a discussion board, is it not?

One thing, however, I feel compelled to agree with and that is that fat does affect mental health. It just remains to be seen if it's low-fat or high-fat consumption that is the cause of mental health issues. That is if it has any effects on the mental capacity of diabetics as well as non-diabetics or if it's just a baseless assumption of someone who may or may not be affected by mental health problems (ie: the author of the article).

BTW, why do you in one sentence say "you are entitled to your opinion" but in the next sentence tell me to "but it out"? :? :?

 

[ailz]

Thanks Sid.

I try to keep below 50 grams of carbs a day. I've been overweight for 52 years (I'm 56) and have tried every diet known to man - except (until I joined this forum) low carb. This is why I'm so interested and un-knowledgeable about the ins and outs of low carbing. I just know that low calorie, low fat doesn't work for me any more. Like I've said I can maintain my weight on 1000 calories. Low carbing has helped my blood glucose and I keep trying to persuade myself that if I lose weight too it's a perk, but really I want to lose weight - I'm 5 stone overweight.

So my questions may seem stupid and look as though they are feeding someone else's agenda - but they really are mine - yes, I really am that stupid .

I was going to post questions earlier, but I found the moderators (sorry, but it's how I feel) intimidating. I'm still not sure whether to just back away from this forum.

Cheers
Ailz

PS Partly I suppose because I really do post under my own name

 

[viviennem]

Don't back away, Ailz, I enjoy your posts. And you're not stupid!

We sound very similar in our lifelong weight and dieting problems. At one point I was actually able to gain weight on 1000 cals per day, and I eventually came to the conclusion that I was not eating enough to lose weight. My body had gone into 'starvation mode' and was hanging on to everything that I gave it!

I have no idea whether the 'starvation mode' can have any basis in truth, and I'd be interested in any comments - preferably well thought out and reasonably polite!

On Atkins again, this time around, my weight loss is much slower than when I followed the diet previously. (Even making allowances for the odd bottle of wine! and the fact that I can't do even moderate exercise at the moment.) I am wondering whether this is because I am much more insulin resistant this time, and this is slowing the weight loss down. I wasn't diabetic the first time. Again, any thoughts would be welcome!

As for the thread title - define 'low fat', and then define 'mentally unstable', please. I do know that low levels of cholesterol have been found in the brains of some people who've died of Alzheimer's, but that doesn't really fit either bill. (Google 'Stephanie Seneff' for her essay on Alzheimer's, if you're interested.)

Viv 8)

 

[AliB]

Hi Ailz.

I can't lose weight either. I only have to sniff carbs and on it goes. I have been assured by the lady who runs the healing diet I am on that it will move eventually once all my hormones have sorted themselves out, but I haven't a clue how long that will take. I can only get a very slow shift if I eat no carbs whatsoever.....

It can be frustrating at times. I may be healing from a lot of other things, but - so far - losing weight isn't one of them. They do say that Menopausal women have the hardest job losing weight. Welcome to the 'club'...

When I first did Atkins some years back the weight fell off - even though I was eating a fair amount of veg, and I felt fantastic, but sadly I listened to the 'naysayers' who were telling me that I would get kidney damage, or some other nasty side effect and I started to reintroduce the carbs. Bad move. The second time I did Atkins the weight wouldn't shift nearly as easily, and now it's almost permanantly welded. Like Viv, I wasn't Diabetic the first time either, but was by the second time. I did manage to lose three stone around the time my digestion collapsed - 1.5 stone in the three horrible months I was on Byetta, and another 1.5 stone afterwards when everything was running straight through me. But since then I have slowly gone up 1.5. My body seems, at present, very reluctant to let go of the weight for some unfathomable reason.

Now I am finding that not only does the weight not shift, but even a small amount of carbs makes my feet puff up. My body just doesn't 'do' carbs at all.

I was told over thirty years ago by a very wise naturopath that I - and indeed everyone - should be eating a lot less carb. She could tell I was very carb intolerant even back then and explained about the insulin response. She put me on a relatively low-carb diet - around 60gm a day I think - and I lost weight, gained energy, was bouncing out of bed in the morning and felt wonderful. Sadly those darn carbs kept sucking me back in. You'd think that tasting that 'elixir' would have taught me wouldn't you. Being in my twenties at the time the diet worked a darn sight better than it does now. Back then on 60gm I lost weight, now on 60gm I'd gain it. I just wish I had had the wisdom and understanding about food back then that I have now. I might just not have become as sick as I have, hey, I might not have even become Diabetic! Regrets.....I've had a few........

I really hope that you can find a carb level at which your body will lose. It is very frustrating when you can't shift it regardless of what you do. To a certain extent though you have to remember that what gets the weight off is generally the type of diet you should eat for life. People think they can go on a 'diet', lose weight and then go back to eating what they were originally. But what they ate originally is what put the weight on in the first place!

 

[AliB]

Viv, this is interesting on the use of Coconut oil to aid Alzheimer's sufferers. It may not be a cure, but perhaps it is a step in the right direction. Perhaps the fatty acids enable the brain to make connections it is unable to make without them.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/health/res ... 024137.ece

Obviously giving someone coconut oil may not address the issue permanently, but what if low-fat is a factor in the Alzheimer's story?

Personally I believe too that one of the biggest factors for recovery would be to remove the damaging foods from the diet too. 'Dead' carbs will also dehydrate the body - and as it appears in Alzheimer's that parts of the brain appear to shrink, maybe removing them would help the body hydrate better!

 

[smidge]

Hi AllB

I'm afraid i can't help you with the losing weight bit of your post cos I find it difficult to stop losing weight and maintain a healthy weight while keeping my BG level :roll: However, I thought I'd respond cos I was concerned about your feet puffing up bit. I don't want to worry you, but feet swelling can be a symptom of serious heart problems and I urge you to discuss this with your GP if it happens again.

Smidge

 

[phoenix]

I'm not quite sure why 'Millymole' is thanking me as I haven't said anything on this thread up till now :?: Strange I did answer on out other 'newbies' thread :roll: !
ailz
I don't know who that blogger was and don't know anything about fibromyalgia but I do know a bit about serotonin. If you want to read about it, then perhaps you would be better reading about it from those who have spent a lifetime researching the affect of various neurotransmitters, especially serotonin and the way they modulate mood than an anoymous blogger..
Richard Wurtman heads up the cognitive sciene lab at MIT. It was his lab that actually discovered the relationship between carb ingestion, tryptophan and serotonin release. Together with Judith Wurtman he has written a classic set of texts on nutrition and the brain .
Here is the simple version: http://asweetlife.org/a-sweet-life-staf ... ety/13940/
and the more complex.
This one is one of the earlier papers, mostly about SAD but it has a good explanation of the serotonin hypothesis
http://wurtmanlab.mit.edu/static/pdf/649.pdf

 

[Ka-Mon]

The link below titled "Carbs Don’t Make You Fat; Excess Calories Do" might be of interest to some of you.

I think some people already know of him and think that he may have been quoted at some time or other, not so sure though.

http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=694

 

[AliB]

Thanks Smidge.

I have had all sorts of weird things happen during the time I have been on this healing journey. This is just the latest. They come, stay for a while and then they go. It is part of the process of my body healing itself and sorting itself out. I am confident that I am giving my body what it needs. I used to be quite frightened by it, but as time has gone by and things are improving I have learned to relax and just let my body get on with its job.

It only happens either if I have had too much carb, or if I haven't drunk enough water during the day. We always assume that things we don't understand are bad occurrences, but that isn't necessarily the case. The body will use any means it can to detox for instance, like rashes, diarrhoea, vomiting. We assume they are something bad, but it's just the body getting rid of stuff it doesn't want.

All symptoms are messages. The body is trying to tell us something - but it is up to us to figure out what.

Viv, you have me thinking on the not enough food angle. I am wondering if perhaps I am not eating enough protein. I think I should be consuming around 70gms per day but I am not sure that I reach that at least some days. Maybe I really ought to pay more attention to the quantity. I tend to go by 'feel' and how hungry I am, because I can't be bothered with too much faffing, but maybe guessing just isn't scientific enough.....

Because being low-carb has naturally curbed my appetite, it does not take much to satisfy my hunger now. I never get ravenous, just pleasantly peckish.

 

[AliB]

Oh dear Ka-mon.

I thought I'd go and have alook at Anthony Colpo's website. Full of himself isn't he.

I found this on there. http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=874

If low-carb can cause mineral deficiencies, and low-fat can cause mineral deficiencies, then anyone who is on both is in a bit of a corner......

As blood tests don't actually show what is going on at cellular level they cannot be relied upon to show a very true picture of what is happening where. They are only a snapshot of what is happening in the bloodstream in the area where the blood was taken at that moment in time. Perhaps there is not much showing in the bloodstream because now people have dumped the inflammatory carbs their cells are finally able to take up the minerals.......

But if you don't believe that, then you could be in trouble.

Everyone thinks they know best. And in my experience the ones that think they know bestest are usually the ones doing the most damage.....

But they MUST be right mustn't they - they've got kwallyficashuns. How come though everyone with kwallyficashuns aren't all singing from the same song sheet?

Just because the majority think something is right, doesn't make it so.

We may not have had a long-term trial on low-carb, but we've had one on low-fat - it's been going on for the last 40-odd years.

PS. Anthony Colpo obviously was not considering me - or a lot of other people who are sick when he wrote the article you posted. Carbs make ME very fat indeed. Besides - he has on the blinkers of a health guru who can't see anything much beyond the next work-out. Remind me to mention that to our blind and overweight Diabetic neighbour who has lost his leg and is confined to a wheelchair, next time I see him, I am sure he will be very gratified to hear it. He undoubtedly will celebrate hearing the news with another packet of biscuits. :roll:

 

[donnellysdogs]

''kwallyficashuns''-can somebody explain this to me???

 

[Hobnoblin]

The link below titled "Carbs Don’t Make You Fat; Excess Calories Do" might be of interest to some of you.

I think some people already know of him and think that he may have been quoted at some time or other, not so sure though.

http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=694

If you look like that Ka-Mon I'll go back to the hobnobs! PMSL

 

[Ka-Mon]

Oh dear Ka-mon.

I thought I'd go and have alook at Anthony Colpo's website. Full of himself isn't he.

I found this on there. http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=874

If low-carb can cause mineral deficiencies, and low-fat can cause mineral deficiencies, then anyone who is on both is in a bit of a corner......

As blood tests don't actually show what is going on at cellular level they cannot be relied upon to show a very true picture of what is happening where. They are only a snapshot of what is happening in the bloodstream in the area where the blood was taken at that moment in time. Perhaps there is not much showing in the bloodstream because now people have dumped the inflammatory carbs their cells are finally able to take up the minerals.......

But if you don't believe that, then you could be in trouble.

Everyone thinks they know best. And in my experience the ones that think they know bestest are usually the ones doing the most damage.....

But they MUST be right mustn't they - they've got kwallyficashuns. How come though everyone with kwallyficashuns aren't all singing from the same song sheet?

Just because the majority think something is right, doesn't make it so.

We may not have had a long-term trial on low-carb, but we've had one on low-fat - it's been going on for the last 40-odd years.

PS. Anthony Colpo obviously was not considering me - or a lot of other people who are sick when he wrote the article you posted. Carbs make ME very fat indeed. Besides - he has on the blinkers of a health guru who can't see anything much beyond the next work-out. Remind me to mention that to our blind and overweight Diabetic neighbour who has lost his leg and is confined to a wheelchair, next time I see him, I am sure he will be very gratified to hear it. He undoubtedly will celebrate hearing the news with another packet of biscuits. :roll:

Yet a few years ago he was actually singing from the same song sheet as Atkins, you and the rest of those who follow a low-carb high-fat diet. That is until he realised that he was not on to a winner and surrounded by what he calls....well, I think you read what I mean on his own blog.

CARBOHYDRATE DIET MYTHS

30 August, 2004

Common Myths About Low Carbohydrate Diets

by Anthony Colpo,
Last updated 9th July 2003

Over the last several years, low-carbohydrate diets have experienced a substantial increase in popularity. However, along with the ever-increasing popularity of these diets, there has been an increase in the number, and virulence, of attacks on them by advocates of the high-carbohydrate, low-animal fat diet theory that came into vogue around 40 years ago. Nutrition "experts", who should know better, repeat common myths about low-carbohydrate eating that are clearly disputed by ample scientific and empirical evidence.

Let's look at some common attacks made on low-carbohydrate diets...

http://homodiet.netfirms.com/otherssay/carbdiet_myth.htm

You might be interested in this one as well, from the same author.

Anyway, this week’s mail includes correspondence from a couple of readers who took exception to my recent post about the poor health and longevity displayed by famous diet gurus. One low-carbing reader appears upset I didn’t deliberately omit the late Dr. Robert Atkins from the discussion, while the other reader…well, I’m not sure what the heck the other reader’s point is; her irrational and incoherent rambling leads me to assume she is just another irrational, incoherent, and rambling low-carbohydrate shill.

http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=521

 

[Hobnoblin]

Ka-mon, just one question. Why do you come into the low carb forum and post such inflammatory remarks. The guy you are quoting is clearly a health nut. He must spend hours a day chiseling a body like that. It's not really relevant to ordinary folks. In fact you won't find many 'natural' body builders with a physique as ripped as his so I'm not sure how much of his dietary advice is relevant.

Low carb has given me so many benefits. Why not let other people just try it for themselves? Why do you want to knock it at every opportunity? This constant back and forth between those who low carb and those who don't is so juvenile. Let people make their own minds up. If you want to low fat great. It didn't work for me, low carb did. Low carb will work for others too!

It does say on the forum description that this isn't a place to discuss the validity of low carb after all.

 

[Ka-Mon]

Ka-mon, just one question. Why do you come into the low carb forum and post such inflammatory remarks. The guy you are quoting is clearly a health nut. He must spend hours a day chiseling a body like that. It's not really relevant to ordinary folks. In fact you won't find many 'natural' body builders with a physique as ripped as his so I'm not sure how much of his dietary advice is relevant.

Low carb has given me so many benefits. Why not let other people just try it for themselves? Why do you want to knock it at every opportunity? This constant back and forth between those who low carb and those who don't is so juvenile. Let people make their own minds up. If you want to low fat great. It didn't work for me, low carb did. Low carb will work for others too!

It does say on the forum description that this isn't a place to discuss the validity of low carb after all.

The links I posted are from a person who advocated low-carb diet at some time and has/was/is being quoted by low-carbers for his "good work".

If low-carbs has given you so many benefits than I am really happy for you and I never have and never will tell you or others to stop following the diet you have chosen and works for you.

OTOH, (in case you haven't seen it) have a look at the heading of this thread and tell me who is posting inflammatory and insulting remarks against anyone who does not follow a low-carb diet.

Yes, this is the low-carb forum and as such should discuss topics such as how low-carbing can help in a friendly and civilised manner instead of insinuating that all non-low carbers are mentally unstable.

This thread was designed and planned to draw attention, it did, so the OP must be very happy with his achievement.

 

[sparkles]

Wow… this post is a headache for a newbie.

I can not believe the level of paranoia in the first few pages. ….Come on!!

Yes I can see that if someone likes to go ‘low-fat‘ the title ‘Low Fat Diets Make you Mentally Unstable.’ is very challenging, insulting - INSULTING even. And perhaps there a case to be made for the poster of something so challenging to acknowledge that in their introduction. But surely it doesn’t mean it can’t be debated as an idea? However ridiculous an idea, trying to intimidate the originator of the post in order to impose censorship is wrong. Surely?

Thank goodness it appears to have settled down towards the end and Millimole and others who feel there’s something worth exploring in the idea can at last get on with it.

As regards to my afore mentioned ’crucifixion’ …just to let everyone know I might be completely limbless (watched the video.) ..but hey still got attitude and do a great head butt!!! …Bounce …bounce
But seriously… I just want to follow the ideas without the fight.

Catherinecherub writes..

‘Nobody here is condemned for the way they manage their diabetes and there is support here for everyone. ‘

I don’t think from my experience as a newbie on this site I can agree with this statement.. Support from Catherine cherub, ka mon, cugila group appears to be as long as you are 1)with them, 2)don’t challenge the status quo, or 3) don’t present a challenging idea. I post on the low carb forum mostly because that’s what I’ve decided I’m interested in. If there is a low carb splinter --into low-carb-high-fat and low-carb-low fat groups who hate each others guts.. Then what am I as a newbie to do? I just want to explore all things low-carb.

Being a bit on the lazy side… (too lazy at this stage to follow all the links.)
Can someone briefly explain to me why some people think that low fat diets make you mentally unstable. Myself being the slightly mentally unstable type (seriously, spent 3 weeks on a psychiatric wing earlier this year and not offended either)….this is of interest to me for a lot of reasons besides the low carb diet issues.
Would love to know more….What is the link between the brain and fats -if there is one? What mental illnesses are we talking? More than 50 years ago everyone ate more fat I think - so were mental illness trends the same then? What exactly is meant by the term ‘mentally more unstable?’

++++
In the space its taken me to compose this… the bickering has started up again. I really do not comprehend:: Ka Mon. Why do you keep trying to sabotage the thread? I don’t want to set myself up against you but Hobnoblin is right.. Its so juvenile. As a newbie who arrived here at diabetes.co.uk as a low-carber, a result not influenced by this site I generally go straight to the Low Carb Forum. I don’t expect to have to fight for the right to low carb or pass a barrier of prejudice every time I want to understand an idea relating to it that someone posts.
Please… just stop. Just let the themes be explored
That’s all people are asking.

Sparkles.