Not getting enough fat. Heard that before?

[Member496333]

Thanks Jim. I often wondered, but never thought to ask till now

It’s worth remembering that we are all slightly different. What’s ideal for one, might not be ideal for the other

 

[Indy51]

My personal opinion is that the "not getting enough fat" message is likely only valid in the period when you're adjusting to the keto diet. Once fat adapted, the body should be able to access its own stored body fat to make up for any lack of dietary fat. Don't shoot me, JMHO.

 

[HSSS]

Do you check if you’re in ketosis?

I go through fazes where I can’t be bothered to eat even though I’m hungry as nothing seems to appeal. On those days calories can be way too low like you. I don’t worry if it’s a one off as they says it’s good to vary intake to keep your body on its toes. However I do force myself if it continues. A mix of cream cheese and double cream whipped up together bumps up the fat and calories and is a nice dessert for me. I eat too many nuts and end up bumping carbs too far if I use them often. I’ve never tried to reach the fat goals though. I see it as a flexible amount up to the limit. If I’m not hungry and have energy I don’t use it.

 

[briped]

My personal opinion is that the "not getting enough fat" message is likely only valid in the period when you're adjusting to the keto diet. Once fat adapted, the body should be able to access its own stored body fat to make up for any lack of dietary fat. Don't shoot me, JMHO.

Maybe you're right, and I have finally started losing weight again, but I'm not sure its caused by fat adaptation. Although I'm far from convinced that the CICO theory is 100% valid, having less than 1000 cals a day most days could have something to do with my weight loss too. Especially because not logging everything didn't do anything for me weight loss wise.
I'm still experimenting with finding out what's exactly right for my 58 year old female cadaver, and getting more fat might make me feel even better - or at least as great as everyone else claims they're feeling. I haven't quite reached that point yet. When I reach it I will stop obsessing, I hope

 

[briped]

Do you check if you’re in ketosis?

I go through fazes where I can’t be bothered to eat even though I’m hungry as nothing seems to appeal. On those days calories can be way too low like you. I don’t worry if it’s a one off as they says it’s good to vary intake to keep your body on its toes. However I do force myself if it continues. A mix of cream cheese and double cream whipped up together bumps up the fat and calories and is a nice dessert for me. I eat too many nuts and end up bumping carbs too far if I use them often. I’ve never tried to reach the fat goals though. I see it as a flexible amount up to the limit. If I’m not hungry and have energy I don’t use it.

You sound like a dietary twin. I'm much the same, and thanks for the cream cheese and cream tip. Do you add any flavours?
Yes, I do check my ketones, but no more than once a month as the test strips are so expensive. On Jan 13th they were 1.2.
I've added the macros for the last two days. Jan 23rd was ridiculous!

 

[HSSS]

I have a whole selection of flavours. Sometimes it’s berries, dark choc shavings or vanilla essence. Peppermint makes it taste like a vienetta if you whip it up nice and thick. I even tried lemon and almond flavours.

What about some cooked sausages in the fridge for fat and protein. Or some nice deli meats wrapped up in cheese slices?

Every now and then I go through some recipes and kick myself up the pants and make myself try a few proper meals. I batch cook as much as I can so there’s the next days meal there too or a freezer meal for total can’t be ***** days. Because I agree constantly undereating isn’t good. One fav is ketovales easy shredded chicken. Very quick and moreish. I add whatever green veg I have even frozen stuff. https://www.ketovale.com/?s=Easy+shredded+chicken+ I’ve used a deli precooked chicken sometime too or done the chicken ahead of time. Makes it even quicker.

 

[Member496333]

My personal opinion is that the "not getting enough fat" message is likely only valid in the period when you're adjusting to the keto diet. Once fat adapted, the body should be able to access its own stored body fat to make up for any lack of dietary fat. Don't shoot me, JMHO.

Yes this is true actually. I do wonder though how the relationship between stored fat and dietary fat works with leptin. Interesting. As always there’s more to learn!

EDIT: Come to think of it. You still need to eat to satiety at each meal. My understanding is that drip feeding calories will slow down the BMR irrespective of your stored body fat. So I guess in that regard a high proportion of each meal’s energy delivery must still come from fat. Stored fat being the fuel source when fasting. Maybe...

Also stored fat cannot be accessed in the presence of insulin, which will be the case during eating. The complexity of how our bodies work continues to mesmerise me

 

[briped]

Also stored fat cannot be accessed in the presence of insulin, which will be the case during eating. The complexity of how our bodies work continues to mesmerise me

Yup, like I said earlier, the one who invented food, eating etc. should be fired. It's way too complicated to sort out in this day and age.

 

[Member496333]

Yup, like I said earlier, the one who invented food, eating etc. should be fired. It's way too complicated to sort out in this day and age.

Try having a BMI of 18.6 then! I can’t comfortably fast for more than 48h and basically have to eat blocks of lard at the dinner table in order to survive

 

[briped]

I have a whole selection of flavours. Sometimes it’s berries, dark choc shavings or vanilla essence. Peppermint makes it taste like a vienetta if you whip it up nice and thick. I even tried lemon and almond flavours.

What about some cooked sausages in the fridge for fat and protein. Or some nice deli meats wrapped up in cheese slices?

Every now and then I go through some recipes and kick myself up the pants and make myself try a few proper meals. I batch cook as much as I can so there’s the next days meal there too or a freezer meal for total can’t be ***** days. Because I agree constantly undereating isn’t good. One fav is ketovales easy shredded chicken. Very quick and moreish. I add whatever green veg I have even frozen stuff. https://www.ketovale.com/?s=Easy+shredded+chicken+ I’ve used a deli precooked chicken sometime too or done the chicken ahead of time. Makes it even quicker.

Good ideas, thank you. Oh, and not something that requires spending a lot of time in the kitchen too. Sounds like a winner.
Tried having sausages in the freezer and having them with scrambled eggs, but I realised that I don't like them anymore, picked them out of the eggs and binned them Do you find that your taste buds are changing too?
I love it when I have remains from the previous day, and ground pork or beef often saves my day. I have been known to pre cook on the rare occasion. Today's lunch is cauli rice cooked in coconut oil and the two much famed chicken drumsticks
Thanks for the link.
My hands are freezing cold, I'm freezing cold. My flat is 21 degrees C. I seem to remember having the same sort of reaction when I lost weight 12 years ago. Can't be a coincidence.

 

[Member496333]

...My hands are freezing cold, I'm freezing cold. My flat is 21 degrees C. I seem to remember having the same sort of reaction when I lost weight 12 years ago. Can't be a coincidence.

Stick with it. You’re essentially changing your metabolic pathways after a lifetime of being a sugar burner. In the fullness of time things should settle down. But yes you’re always more likely to feel the cold when it’s actually cold and you’re carrying around less insulation

 

[briped]

your metallic pathways

Yes, a bit of an iron lady here Spelling controls, eh?
Well, the truth is that since end of March I've lost a total of 19kgs/3 st. I'd just forgotten how the process felt, and love my new down slippers. Sleep with them at night now, so no longer have the difficult choice of keeping either shoulders or feet warm.
Of course I'll stick with it. I'm very happy with my BG readings, so I don't see I have a choice.

 

[Member496333]

Ha! Edited. Thanks!

 

[pixie1]

my daughter runs marathons. She is 4' 11" tall and weighs 9 stones 10lbs and is technically overweight with a BMI of around 29. Her doctor laughs at BMI. She is very lean with big muscles.

The BMI was invented for children who were undernourished and underweight, which effected their growth, did not reach what should have been their proper height, basically suffered from stunted growth.
Children were placed in boarding schools were they received an education and proper nutritional meals, they found a significant difference to their growth.

The BMI is now obsolete, as its being used for which is not intended for. This is possibly the reason why tall, fit stronger people seem to be overweight.
To me a new calculation needs to be invented,

 

[jpscloud]

Good ideas, thank you. Oh, and not something that requires spending a lot of time in the kitchen too. Sounds like a winner.
Tried having sausages in the freezer and having them with scrambled eggs, but I realised that I don't like them anymore, picked them out of the eggs and binned them Do you find that your taste buds are changing too?
I love it when I have remains from the previous day, and ground pork or beef often saves my day. I have been known to pre cook on the rare occasion. Today's lunch is cauli rice cooked in coconut oil and the two much famed chicken drumsticks
Thanks for the link.
My hands are freezing cold, I'm freezing cold. My flat is 21 degrees C. I seem to remember having the same sort of reaction when I lost weight 12 years ago. Can't be a coincidence.

I'm feeling the cold much more since starting low carbing and IF- I was famous at work for not wearing a coat between buildings but now I wrap up like Scott of the Antarctic!

 

[Bluetit1802]

Have you tried having more oily fish on the same plate as a boiled egg and cheese? For lunch today I will be having a small tin of salmon, a boiled egg, about 8 or 9 small cubes of cheese, a very large dollop or two of mayonnaise, and several cherry toms. There is enough protein and fat in that lot to sink a battle ship.

 

[Member496333]

I’m going to step in there and recommend making one’s own mayonnaise, also. The shop bought stuff tastes awful in comparison and is invariably made with seed oils. Other than that, great lunch! Enough fat to give Ancel Keys a post-mortem heart attack.

 

[lucylocket61]

stored fat cannot be accessed in the presence of insulin, which will be the case during eating.

WOW, thanks for that info. I didnt know that. How long after eating does the insulin stop being around and i burn my own fat? This could be why eating only twice a day works better for me in general.

 

[Member496333]

WOW, thanks for that info. I didnt know that. How long after eating does the insulin stop being around and i burn my own fat? This could be why eating only twice a day works better for me in general.

As always with these things I imagine it’s a sliding scale. How long insulin will remain elevated above baseline will depend very much on your blood glucose levels. If your BG is constantly elevated then insulin will probably be permanently elevated alongside it. That’s why T2 diabetics generally become obese pre-diagnosis. It’s actually a protective mechanism. Some people can’t get fat so they just get diabetes quicker than they otherwise would have. Me being one of them.

And yes, the fewer times you eat, the fewer “episodes” of insulin release. This is why it’s optimal to eat fewer meals but to complete satiety rather than snacking on nibbles all day and encouraging near constant insulin secretion. The difference this can make is profound.

 

[Flora123]

I'm feeling the cold much more since starting low carbing and IF- I was famous at work for not wearing a coat between buildings but now I wrap up like Scott of the Antarctic!

Me too!! I’m cold all the time. Drives my partner mad