Remission - What Works

[Stephen Lewis]

From reading these posts and my own surfing there seems to be so much information and research out there with no-one moderating unless the results appear in one of the medical journals. It would be nice to have a library of current research which has been examined by a sufficiently qualified person/team with appropriate comments and into reasonable categories. Anyone know of this or could diabetes.co.uk do this?

 

[Thomas the Tank]

I feel that there is a lot of debate/confusion about Type 2 remission. There are many definitions used for remission in different studies , studies are of vastly differing robustness, duration etc. And I have seen several focusing on health in general that appear to flatly contradict each other - though these tend to be the epidemiological ones relying on just a 'food questionnaire' answers.

I have a problem with the term 'remission' thinking 'suppression' is more accurate. I do not believe that I am (Hb1Ac 39 for 2 years on keto/ LCHF) in remission but that my lifestyle is suppressing my T2 symptoms. The reason for this? Eat a few high carb meals (75gm+) and my Bg rockets into the 11+ range . If I was in remission this would not happen. What ever the name I feel better now than i did 9 years ago when I first diagnosed myself as T2 then confirmed by my Gp with fasting Bg 15+.

 

[TwoTone]

Hi Ianf0ster,
After 15 years as a T2D and increasing BGs and losing control, I am now reversing the effects of T2D. Two years ago I stopped eating meat and have now halved the metformin I'm on and heading for another reduction. I've also increased the carbs I eat.
Here's a thought: Is insulin resistance caused by uric acid crystal build up in the soft tissue?

 

[Caprock94]

Hi Ianf0ster,
After 15 years as a T2D and increasing BGs and losing control, I am now reversing the effects of T2D. Two years ago I stopped eating meat and have now halved the metformin I'm on and heading for another reduction. I've also increased the carbs I eat.
Here's a thought: Is insulin resistance caused by uric acid crystal build up in the soft tissue?

Interesting. This is kind of the opposite approach to what many have had success with here.

 

[VashtiB]

Hi Ianf0ster,
After 15 years as a T2D and increasing BGs and losing control, I am now reversing the effects of T2D. Two years ago I stopped eating meat and have now halved the metformin I'm on and heading for another reduction. I've also increased the carbs I eat.
Here's a thought: Is insulin resistance caused by uric acid crystal build up in the soft tissue?

I also think this is interesting. I'm curious as to how many carbs you are currently eating and what your blood sugar levels are before and after meals. Are you able to set out a typical days meals with your levels. I kn ow there have been a few threads with people asking g for ways to reduce the blood sugar levels other than low carb so I'm sure there will be a few people interested.

For me- I didn't eat much meat before my diagnosis- not a vegetarian just don't like meat- I had red meat probably 4-5 times a year and chicken and sea food up to 4 or so times a week- but often less. Just not a fan of meat. I now eat meat every day and m y blood sugar levels have decreased into normal levels. As a c arb addict not a meat addict I am interested. so if you can share your diet and results I would appreciate it.

 

[Thomas the Tank]

According to my GP and a CDE I spoke to at Diabetes Queensland, that there is no such thing a remission or reversed with T2 diabetes in Queensland or Australia most probably.

This why I am saying I have my T2 under very good control, now if I start eating rubbish food again I will revert back to where I was nearly three years ago and not under control.

Sorry missed this post when I replied about the term 'remission' v 'suppression' but it is exactly the point I was making. I am also 'under very good control' and suppressing the symptoms of T2 as long as I keep my lifestyle under control. Over Christmas I checked my Bg reading before and after eating Christmas pudding alongside my non diabetic son. Before the meal we were both in the 4.4 to 5.0 range but at 2 hrs he was 6.8 and i was 15.0( My low carb post meal reading is usually under 7.8). My Hb1Ac for past 2 years has been 39 with no medication but i am not in remission. I just suppress the symptoms with LCHF but I am happy to keep the devil at bay. Most pharmaceutical drugs only suppress symptoms anyway so it may help achieve wider acceptance if we call it suppression not remission or even reversal.

 

[ianf0ster]

Sorry missed this post when I replied about the term 'remission' v 'suppression' but it is exactly the point I was making. I am also 'under very good control' and suppressing the symptoms of T2 as long as I keep my lifestyle under control. Over Christmas I checked my Bg reading before and after eating Christmas pudding alongside my non diabetic son. Before the meal we were both in the 4.4 to 5.0 range but at 2 hrs he was 6.8 and i was 15.0( My low carb post meal reading is usually under 7.8). My Hb1Ac for past 2 years has been 39 with no medication but i am not in remission. I just suppress the symptoms with LCHF but I am happy to keep the devil at bay. Most pharmaceutical drugs only suppress symptoms anyway so it may help achieve wider acceptance if we call it suppression not remission or even reversal.

Hi,
Call it whatever you like. I use the term remission because this is what the main 'players' in the NHS call it.
As I pointed out earlier, I'm unhappy that in my opinion the term is used even when all that has been achieved is a single HbA1C in the pre-diabetic range and include those still on Metformin. My view is that it should be a level below pre-diabetic , should have been maintained for at least 12 months and should be with no diabetes medication whatsoever.

 

[Thomas the Tank]

Seeing the great work members here have done changing perceptions and getting LCHF recognised by the NHS 'main players' maybe we could get a more accurate terminology accepted as well.
I also agree with you that reading should be below pre-diabetic for at least 12 months before it's called anything but 'starting to be under control'.

 

[JayAmerican]

It's like someone with nut allergies referring to themselves as being in remission just because they are not eating nuts. The bottom line is that there is no remission unless the body is shown to actually have become insulin-sensitive again without the aid of drugs. If anyone with T2 gets their A1C in check even consistently for many years, but their blood sugar shoots up if they have any carb or sugar filled meal, it mean they are still T2 and simply suppressing the symptoms. Like everyone else, I would be ecstatic if it were found there was an actual cure and not just carb-free eating, it just seems unlikely.

 

[Daphne917]

Hi,
Call it whatever you like. I use the term remission because this is what the main 'players' in the NHS call it.
As I pointed out earlier, I'm unhappy that in my opinion the term is used even when all that has been achieved is a single HbA1C in the pre-diabetic range and include those still on Metformin. My view is that it should be a level below pre-diabetic , should have been maintained for at least 12 months and should be with no diabetes medication whatsoever.

My hba1c has been at non diabetic levels for over 6 years but my DN still says I’m ‘well controlled’ as opposed to ‘in remission’. I’ve annotated myself as in remission on here because I’ve managed to maintain that level on approx 130g carbs per day - more on some days and can eat small portions of mashed potato and pasta without affecting my BS.

 

[Listlad]

Hi,
My view is that it should be a level below pre-diabetic , should have been maintained for at least 12 months and should be with no diabetes medication whatsoever.

Yes, good idea. I think this is what is needed. In my own case even though my blood sugar levels have been below the Prediabetic range my surgery still has me earmarked as diabetic. For now at least. The idea that I am cured is a false one.

 

[Thomas the Tank]

It's like someone with nut allergies referring to themselves as being in remission just because they are not eating nuts. The bottom line is that there is no remission unless the body is shown to actually have become insulin-sensitive again without the aid of drugs. If anyone with T2 gets their A1C in check even consistently for many years, but their blood sugar shoots up if they have any carb or sugar filled meal, it mean they are still T2 and simply suppressing the symptoms. Like everyone else, I would be ecstatic if it were found there was an actual cure and not just carb-free eating, it just seems unlikely.

You hit the nail right on the head! No remission just suppression.

 

[Lotties]

My hba1c has been at non diabetic levels for over 6 years but my DN still says I’m ‘well controlled’ as opposed to ‘in remission’. I’ve annotated myself as in remission on here because I’ve managed to maintain that level on approx 130g carbs per day - more on some days and can eat small portions of mashed potato and pasta without affecting my BS.

Uplifting results.
Nice to hear the light at the end of the tunnel may not be a train coming the other way!

 

[Krystyna23040]

It's like someone with nut allergies referring to themselves as being in remission just because they are not eating nuts. The bottom line is that there is no remission unless the body is shown to actually have become insulin-sensitive again without the aid of drugs. If anyone with T2 gets their A1C in check even consistently for many years, but their blood sugar shoots up if they have any carb or sugar filled meal, it mean they are still T2 and simply suppressing the symptoms. Like everyone else, I would be ecstatic if it were found there was an actual cure and not just carb-free eating, it just seems unlikely.

That's me exactly. Non-diabetic hba1c but if I stray over 20g a day blood sugars shoot up. The nut allergy analogy exactly explains my T2D. I only have normal blood sugars because I avoid the carbs.

 

[ianf0ster]

Seeing the great work members here have done changing perceptions and getting LCHF recognised by the NHS 'main players' maybe we could get a more accurate terminology accepted as well.
I also agree with you that reading should be below pre-diabetic for at least 12 months before it's called anything but 'starting to be under control'.

Let's not lose sight of the fact that actually getting GPs to talk about any form of long term control or reversal of symptoms for a disease thought for the past 30 to 40 yrs as being inevitably chronic and progressive is huge progress! No matter which terms are used.
I have noted on both this and the other UK forum, some members still talk about having 'controlled BG' when all they mean is that their HbA1C is well into the full diabetic range (so they are at least at risk of neuropathy and retinopathy), but that it isn't getting progressively worse (yet)!

 

[Listlad]

That's me exactly. Non-diabetic hba1c but if I stray over 20g a day blood sugars shoot up. The nut allergy analogy exactly explains my T2D. I only have normal blood sugars because I avoid the carbs.

Sounds like me. Perhaps a larger leeway, but similar all the same.

 

[Listlad]

Let's not lose sight of the fact that actually getting GPs to talk about any form of long term control or reversal of symptoms for a disease thought for the past 30 to 40 yrs as being inevitably chronic and progressive is huge progress! No matter which terms are used.
I have noted on both this and the other UK forum, some members still talk about having 'controlled BG' when all they mean is that their HbA1C is well into the full diabetic range (so they are at least at risk of neuropathy and retinopathy), but that is isn't getting progressively worse (yet)!

My GP was referring to my “diabetes” even though my HbA1c was just under the Prediabetic range. We had a similar discussion on remission / reversal or whatever one wants to call it. We both agreed that to ensure I stay clear of diabetic symptoms that I manage my blood glucose levels with dietary control. I am quite comfortable with this GP as he is closely connected with the Southport surgery.

 

[ianf0ster]

This new video from Dr Paul Mason is a little of the subject of T2D Remission /Control, but covers so many of the myths about Low Carb WOE or keto


Are you smarter (or just better informed) than your doctor?

Dr Paul Mason's video covers all the major Low Carb and Keto related myths -
T2D, CVD, Bone Density, Cancer, Dementia, Obesity, Insulin, inflammation Fructose, Carbs, Seed Oils, Omega 6 Oils, Salt, HDL, LDL, Statins and more:

 

[Mbaker]

This new video from Dr Paul Mason is a little of the subject of T2D Remission /Control, but covers so many of the myths about Low Carb WOE or keto


Are you smarter (or just better informed) than your doctor?

Dr Paul Mason's video covers all the major Low Carb and Keto related myths -
T2D, CVD, Bone Density, Cancer, Dementia, Obesity, Insulin, inflammation Fructose, Carbs, Seed Oils, Omega 6 Oils, Salt, HDL, LDL, Statins and more:

I was gonna put this up yesterday after listening to on my walk. This is what I call a Zinger, a one stop video that deals with almost every aspect concerning metabolic health. This is the video I would give to someone who needs to hear the story from someone who fixed their metabolic health, is a health care professional who was on the other side, understands the mechanisms - the why and how, and has a practice which fixes people verifiably.

 

[shelley262]

This new video from Dr Paul Mason is a little of the subject of T2D Remission /Control, but covers so many of the myths about Low Carb WOE or keto


Are you smarter (or just better informed) than your doctor?

Dr Paul Mason's video covers all the major Low Carb and Keto related myths -
T2D, CVD, Bone Density, Cancer, Dementia, Obesity, Insulin, inflammation Fructose, Carbs, Seed Oils, Omega 6 Oils, Salt, HDL, LDL, Statins and more:

Thank you excellent video
@Mauriac recommended