Cholesterol and Statins

[bulkbiker]

Many thanks to Bulkbiker and others for this post. I am due to see a lipid Consultant next Tuesday (referred by my Diabetes Consultant) due to my cholesterol being 6.6 (HDL 2.2, trigs 0.5 and the rest LDL). NO family history that would indicate FH but the Diabetes Consultant says in his opinion, that is what he thinks I have. All current glucose levels are good/weight in the middle of the BMI range/exercise every day/don't smoke or drink etc - I say this just to set the scene!). I will be fully armed (because of THIS post) to ask him very direct questions about statins, I would be grateful for any specific questions anyone thinks I should ask!

Ask him if he would take them in your situation?
That will show ho much he knows about the possible side effects and other damage they can do to you.
Edit to ad completely amazing Trig/HDL ratio nice..

 

[ArsenalCath]

There are always a lot of threads about Statins and Cholesterol and we all post our various favourite bits of current presentations about them but I thought it might be handy to have them all in one thread. I meant to put this together soon after the get together in Birmingham (sorry @Debandez) but have been a bit distracted (thanks to twitter) since then so thought it was about time I pulled my finger out and put something down. I'll try and take the best bits of what I have posted previously and nick some bits from others... please anyone feel free to add what you find so we can have a one stop shop for the curious.

Full disclosure... I can't think of a single reason why I would take a statin.. ever

LDL Does Not Cause Cardiovascular Disease
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17512433.2018.1519391?scroll=top&needAccess=true

full study here
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pybuhn9wph2smgy/20180910 KENDRICK etc. LDL-C Does Not Cause Cardiovascular Disease - a comprehensive review.pdf?dl=0

Need a link to the great Dr Malcolm Kendrick... no statin page would be complete without the sceptic in chief...

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/about/

Great piece explaining how statins work and the nasty things they may be doing to you by Nick Mailer

Why your LDL may go up on a low carb/ketogenic regime

Dave Feldman and of course a link to his site

http://cholesterolcode.com

Statins stimulate atherosclerosis?

http://explore.tandfonline.com/content/med/statins-stimulate-atherosclerosis-and-heart-failure

Flaws in early statin trials

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/
" Curiously, statin trials conducted after 2005 have failed to demonstrate a consistent mortality benefit"

Statin induced diabetes

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4156828/

Statin induced peripheral neuropathy

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3103035/

Prof Sherif Sultan doesn't like them much either and he is/was President of International Society for Vascular Surgery

Nor does David Diamond

Also a huge amount of info from Ivor Cummins

http://www.thefatemperor.com

Hopefully that will be a start...

Should I just stop taking statins? I feel I should stop. A doc on the radio yesterday said they do not prevent heart attacks so why have I been prescribed them. I’m thinking I will just reduce fat intake which is pretty low in any case. I’ve lost half my body weight my last blood results show that I have normal liver function so no fatty liver any more. What I read and hear about statins is not very reassuring. I’m on 40mg a day. My husband who is overweight is only in 10mg.

 

[bulkbiker]

Should I just stop taking statins? I feel I should stop. A doc on the radio yesterday said they do not prevent heart attacks so why have I been prescribed them. I’m thinking I will just reduce fat intake which is pretty low in any case. I’ve lost half my body weight my last blood results show that I have normal liver function so no fatty liver any more. What I read and hear about statins is not very reassuring. I’m on 40mg a day. My husband who is overweight is only in 10mg.

We can't advise you what to do... it's a decision you have to make yourself like all medicines.
My reason for starting the thread was to show that there is a significant body of scientists out there who think statins are not a good idea. I happen to agree with them. Most doctors are apparently unaware of this newer thinking which I'm afraid is more a reflection on them than on their patients.

 

[Guzzler]

Should I just stop taking statins? I feel I should stop. A doc on the radio yesterday said they do not prevent heart attacks so why have I been prescribed them. I’m thinking I will just reduce fat intake which is pretty low in any case. I’ve lost half my body weight my last blood results show that I have normal liver function so no fatty liver any more. What I read and hear about statins is not very reassuring. I’m on 40mg a day. My husband who is overweight is only in 10mg.

You must, must, must make that decision for yourself. Take into account your full lipid profile, your familial history and your personal history. Read up on the articles/studies in this thread, watch some of the lectures and then have the discussion with your GP. Best wishes.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Many thanks to Bulkbiker and others for this post. I am due to see a lipid Consultant next Tuesday (referred by my Diabetes Consultant) due to my cholesterol being 6.6 (HDL 2.2, trigs 0.5 and the rest LDL). NO family history that would indicate FH but the Diabetes Consultant says in his opinion, that is what he thinks I have. All current glucose levels are good/weight in the middle of the BMI range/exercise every day/don't smoke or drink etc - I say this just to set the scene!). I will be fully armed (because of THIS post) to ask him very direct questions about statins, I would be grateful for any specific questions anyone thinks I should ask!

You have a very over reactive consultant in my opinion. Those levels are very similar to my last test. This is what NICE says:

1.3.7 Consider the possibility of familial hypercholesterolaemia and investigate as described in familial hypercholesterolaemia (NICE guideline CG71) if they have:

• a total cholesterol concentration more than 7.5 mmol/litre and
  
  
• a family history of premature coronary heart disease. [new 2014]
  

1.3.8 Arrange for specialist assessment of people with a total cholesterol concentration of more than 9.0 mmol/litre or a non‑HDL cholesterol concentration of more than 7.5 mmol/litre even in the absence of a first‑degree family history of premature coronary heart disease. [new 2014]

1.3.9 Refer for urgent specialist review if a person has a triglyceride concentration of more than 20 mmol/litre that is not a result of excess alcohol or poor glycaemic control. [new 2014]

 

[Indy51]

Many thanks to Bulkbiker and others for this post. I am due to see a lipid Consultant next Tuesday (referred by my Diabetes Consultant) due to my cholesterol being 6.6 (HDL 2.2, trigs 0.5 and the rest LDL). NO family history that would indicate FH but the Diabetes Consultant says in his opinion, that is what he thinks I have. All current glucose levels are good/weight in the middle of the BMI range/exercise every day/don't smoke or drink etc - I say this just to set the scene!). I will be fully armed (because of THIS post) to ask him very direct questions about statins, I would be grateful for any specific questions anyone thinks I should ask!

Your levels don't sound nearly high enough for FH. I remember an endocrinologist telling me they don't think about FH until levels are above 9.0mmol.

 

[bulkbiker]

Another handy resource quoting not only a precis of the papers but then with links to the papers themselves.

http://www.statinnation.net/blog/20...5YrmSParOiuV9ZyeR8iHZPsNTUPqJd67e4_u5olUaa75A

 

[KK123]

Thanks to all who replied. I didn't think my levels were high enough either and nearly made a fuss but then thought, well why not go and maybe get some more specific tests. (Don't know exactly what they do but they said to fast as there would be a blood test).

 

[bulkbiker]

Avoidance of dementia.. high LDL!

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2018.00952/abstract

 

[bulkbiker]

Thanks to all who replied. I didn't think my levels were high enough either and nearly made a fuss but then thought, well why not go and maybe get some more specific tests. (Don't know exactly what they do but they said to fast as there would be a blood test).

Sounds like a good idea..data is always good.

 

[KK123]

Avoidance of dementia.. high LDL!

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2018.00952/abstract

Yes!!!!!!! Now if only I could remember what I was saying...…...

 

[mondFi]

I can't say that I found this article compelling and it doesn't provide enough references to support its arguments but in the interests of seeing the other side here is a link to a Guardian article "Butter nonsense: the rise of the cholesterol deniers"

 

[KK123]

I can't say that I found this article compelling and it doesn't provide enough references to support its arguments but in the interests of seeing the other side here is a link to a Guardian article "Butter nonsense: the rise of the cholesterol deniers"

Yep, always good to see these articles. My LDL is most definitely not caused by butter etc though, I personally follow lowish carb, low fat.

 

[bulkbiker]

I can't say that I found this article compelling and it doesn't provide enough references to support its arguments but in the interests of seeing the other side here is a link to a Guardian article "Butter nonsense: the rise of the cholesterol deniers"

Otherwise known as "Big Pharma strikes back..."

 

[set-in-stone]

I can't say that I found this article compelling and it doesn't provide enough references to support its arguments but in the interests of seeing the other side here is a link to a Guardian article "Butter nonsense: the rise of the cholesterol deniers"

Interesting! Thanks for sharing

 

[set-in-stone]

@bulkbiker Thank you for kicking off this thread. Very informative. Will be sharing with hubby who was offered statins a few months into T2 diagnosis by the GP. He said “No thanks”. GP was not happy

He is now in remission, and stopped all meds from eating LCHF. His Doc thinks it’s all down to Metformin

 

[bulkbiker]

Drop this one off here too Sat fat is it bad?

 

[PatsyB]

when i suggested I should stop taking statins to the Nurse she said I would most probably be dead by now if I had not started taking them when told to ?? so what should I believe and do should I keep take them or should I stop take them//////////

 

[Mike d]

Your choice. We cannot tell you what to do apart from looking at the evidence

 

[Bluetit1802]

when i suggested I should stop taking statins to the Nurse she said I would most probably be dead by now if I had not started taking them when told to ?? so what should I believe and do should I keep take them or should I stop take them//////////

Read and listen to all the links in this thread, then make up your own mind. We can't tell you one way or the other. All we can do is tell you if we would ever take them. Personally, I will never take them.