Covid and Work, Covid Advice and General Chat

[DCUKMod]

This cropped up on my Twitter feed yesterday, courtesy of Professor Sikora.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...-variant-with-milder-infections-idUSKBN25H0O1

 

[Tannith]

Don't worry as I am sure kindly retailer will take advantage of the panic pandemic evinced in this thread and supply some branded masks! And look how well they are doing in Thailand:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-53877292
WHO recommendations for schools:
For teachers, the WHO says: "In areas where there is widespread transmission, all adults under the age of 60 and who are in general good health should wear fabric masks when they cannot guarantee at least a one-metre distance from others.

"This is particularly important for adults working with children who may have close contact with children and one another."

Adults aged 60 or over, or those with underlying health conditions, should wear medical masks, it says.
The advice published on the WHO website covers three age groups:

• Children aged 12 and over should wear a mask under the same conditions as adults, in particular when they cannot guarantee a distance of at least one metre from others and there is widespread transmission in the area

The WHO guidance does not specify whether a child over the age of 12 should wear a mask in school, but it may yet become a feature of the classroom as the new academic year begins.

France recently made it mandatory for all children over 11, and a number of schools in the UK are taking it upon themselves to require students to wear them even though this is not official government guidance.

James Gillespie's High School in Edinburgh is one such school, making the decision to require students to "wear face coverings indoors whilst moving around between classes" after taking feedback from pupils, staff and parents. Nicola Sturgeon, the first minister of Scotland has warned secondary school students may be required to wear face coverings in the "near future".

 

[JohnEGreen]

"Coronavirus: Missing school is worse than virus for children - Whitty"

This shows that even highly placed experts can make the most foolish statements and pronouncements.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53875410

So far I have not been able to ascertain the number of deaths of children caused directly by missing school but so far there have been at least 71 children admitted to intensive care units with covid 19 in the UK of which 5 have died.

 

[Fairygodmother]

"Coronavirus: Missing school is worse than virus for children - Whitty"

This shows that even highly placed experts can make the most foolish statements and pronouncements.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53875410

So far I have not been able to ascertain the number of deaths of children caused directly by missing school but so far there have been at least 71 children admitted to intensive care units with covid 19 in the UK of which 5 have died.

Witty does go on to say that it’s the adults who’ll be most at risk when schools reopen, and that he expects an increases in cases when people (parents?) return to work.
Surely this is an argument for PPE for adult school staff, and for continuing to work from home if you can.

 

[JohnEGreen]

Again I wonder if Dr Whitty had a family children or grandchildren would he be so sanguine about the risks involved.

 

[Fairygodmother]

He’s working for the govt. Others, less sanguine, were ousted. It’s the £3trillion National debt doing the talking and at least Witty’s shown it’s not going to be totally ‘safe’ to open schools and return to work.
Elsewhere there are articles about the difficulties of transport for workers and children, the perfect storm looming after 31 Dec and trying to avoid another national lockdown.

 

[Max68]

Thing is everyone has an agenda.. Government it's purely the economy. Professor Karol Sikora (mentioned in a post above), is an Oncologist so his agenda will clearly be his patients suffering with cancer so understandably he focuses on that and in many of his interviews seems quite dismissive of Covid as any real threat. So the problem is the top levels in the country aren't all pulling in the same direction.

 

[Tannith]

He’s working for the govt. Others, less sanguine, were ousted. It’s the £3trillion National debt doing the talking and at least Witty’s shown it’s not going to be totally ‘safe’ to open schools and return to work.
Elsewhere there are articles about the difficulties of transport for workers and children, the perfect storm looming after 31 Dec and trying to avoid another national lockdown.

Does something special happen after 31 Dec? Apart, that is, from the surge of cases caused by Christmas family gatherings.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Surely this is an argument for PPE for adult school staff,

2 things.
1. Don't call me Shirley.

2. Due the the number of cluster that have broken out in Scottish schools since they went back the Scottish government is now trying hard not to make a decision but thinks pupils may have to ware face masks in the future.

I don't have an answer to this other than keep the schools closed, which has its own set of problem's. The only thing we can look back on for guidance is the Spanish flue which most of us are informed enough to know had a second and third wave both even deadlier than the first. By all accounts this could have been mitigated by being more cautious reopening the country.

As the saying goes " Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

 

[There is no Spoon]

the surge of cases caused by Christmas family gatherings.

Didn't you know Christmas is cancelled.
Santa is self isolating.

 

[lucylocket61]

Does something special happen after 31 Dec? Apart, that is, from the surge of cases caused by Christmas family gatherings.

Brexit with no deal, or an unworkable deal, and lots of complications over customs with or without a deal.

 

[NicoleC1971]

"Coronavirus: Missing school is worse than virus for children - Whitty"

This shows that even highly placed experts can make the most foolish statements and pronouncements.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53875410

So far I have not been able to ascertain the number of deaths of children caused directly by missing school but so far there have been at least 71 children admitted to intensive care units with covid 19 in the UK of which 5 have died.

We know that additional children committed suicide (child mortality dataase for England) as a result of lockdown (estimated to account for 12 of the 25 suicides occurring in children in the first 56 days of lockdown in England. Those deaths were linked to people suffering with autism, ADHD type disorders.
It is likely that less kids were killed in traffic accidents so who knows how the relative risks can be counted.
The point is there is next to zero risk of illness and death from this virus as the figures you quoted show (about the same number of kids die of the flu and those are mainly those with other health issues as with Covid) for that age group versus the harms done to their life chances and your socio-economic status does have a direct impact on your health.

 

[NicoleC1971]

Just a thought to add to the confusion. I have four friends friends who have had Covid19. Two of them, a mother and daughter were in the same household where the daughter had caught the virus from a work colleague who actually died as a result of Covid19. Yet my mate Wyn, the father, had no symptoms at all. Did he have the virus and remain completely asymptomatic. Another one of the four had tested positive, yet his wife and two children showed no signs. The wife of the fourth person also showed no signs of the virus. So the virus seems to behave in a strange way, maybe some people are already immune? Who knows.

The Diamond Princess was good natural experiment in that the ship passengers and crew were highly exposed before any mitigating measures were taken and then all of the population on the ship were tested.
About 20% of the ship tested positive and of these 75% were asymptomatic.
(the case fatality rate was 1.1% but this is not adjusted for the likely impact of age/health complications) i.e. the case fatality rate in the general population is likely much lower

 

[lucylocket61]

I see that the latest report says that only 67 people got infected in schools in June in the Uk.

Guardian website 4h ago11:02

"England's schools had 67 Covid-19 cases in June, PHE report finds
A total of 67 coronavirus cases and 30 outbreaks were detected in schools across England in June, according to Public Health England.

The health agency on Sunday released the findings of a study into levels of coronavirus transmission in educational settings following their reopening on June 1.

It found that Covid-19 infections and outbreaks were “uncommon”. In June, the number of children attending any educational setting increased from 475,000 to more than 1.6 million.

The report adds that there is a strong correlation between the regional incidence of Covid-19 and the number of outbreaks in educational settings, which “emphasises the importance of controlling community transmission”.

The 67 cases occurred mainly in primary school and early years settings and were made up of 30 students and 37 staff.

No children were admitted to hospital, but one teacher was hospitalised and was admitted to intensive care for respiratory support.

Updated at 11.04am BST"

1) there was good social distancing possible, and only a third of the pupils in classrooms.

2) it was a hot June, with windows open, many classes held outside, and pupils only there for half a day or so at a time.

3) vulnerable people were still isolating, public transport sharing was very sparse, and most shops etc were still shut, with social contract rigorously reduced, including among family members.

Do these muppets not realise that having full classes in heated rooms with little or no ventilation is a different scenario? I do not believe their apparent stupidity is accidental. This is all about money, full stop. We, Jo Public, are collateral damage. What is more, they think we are so stupid we cannot reason or understand. The contempt for the average person, behind the policies and media stories, is palpable.

 

[Tannith]

I see that the latest report says that only 67 people got infected in schools in June in the Uk.

Guardian website 4h ago11:02

"England's schools had 67 Covid-19 cases in June, PHE report finds
A total of 67 coronavirus cases and 30 outbreaks were detected in schools across England in June, according to Public Health England.

The health agency on Sunday released the findings of a study into levels of coronavirus transmission in educational settings following their reopening on June 1.

It found that Covid-19 infections and outbreaks were “uncommon”. In June, the number of children attending any educational setting increased from 475,000 to more than 1.6 million.

The report adds that there is a strong correlation between the regional incidence of Covid-19 and the number of outbreaks in educational settings, which “emphasises the importance of controlling community transmission”.

The 67 cases occurred mainly in primary school and early years settings and were made up of 30 students and 37 staff.

No children were admitted to hospital, but one teacher was hospitalised and was admitted to intensive care for respiratory support.

Updated at 11.04am BST"

1) there was good social distancing possible, and only a third of the pupils in classrooms.

2) it was a hot June, with windows open, many classes held outside, and pupils only there for half a day or so at a time.

3) vulnerable people were still isolating, public transport sharing was very sparse, and most shops etc were still shut, with social contract rigorously reduced, including among family members.

Do these muppets not realise that having full classes in heated rooms with little or no ventilation is a different scenario? I do not believe their apparent stupidity is accidental. This is all about money, full stop. We, Jo Public, are collateral damage. What is more, they think we are so stupid we cannot reason or understand. The contempt for the average person, behind the policies and media stories, is palpable.

Maybe we should have the kids back in school , but not the teachers?

 

[JohnEGreen]

Early years settings were also asked to begin welcoming back all children from
1 June. We estimate that 166,000 children were attending early years settings
on 4 June – about 10% of the number of children who usually attend in term
time.

https://assets.publishing.service.g..._figures_coronavirus_covid_19_4_June_2020.pdf

 

[DCUKMod]

Thing is everyone has an agenda.. Government it's purely the economy. Professor Karol Sikora (mentioned in a post above), is an Oncologist so his agenda will clearly be his patients suffering with cancer so understandably he focuses on that and in many of his interviews seems quite dismissive of Covid as any real threat. So the problem is the top levels in the country aren't all pulling in the same direction.

Yes, everyone has an agenda, and that includes everyone contributing to this thread.

Professor Sikora will, of course, champion for those under his care, and for those who should be under his care - except that they may not have access to diagnostic tests, or worse still, access to treatment for a know cancerous growth.

 

[JohnEGreen]

Yes, everyone has an agenda, and that includes everyone contributing to this thread.

Oh thank you I've always wanted one of those and now it seems I have one the miracles of modern technology.

 

[lucylocket61]

my agenda is the safety of others and myself. Including the truth about what we are being told and highlighting the straw men and attempts at deflection, plus the illogical and shady 'facts and figures' being bandied about by meany.

 

[DCUKMod]

my agenda is the safety of others and myself. Including the truth about what we are being told and highlighting the straw men and attempts at deflection, plus the illogical and shady 'facts and figures' being bandied about by meany.

Agendas can be positive, humane, compassionate and all the other words we like to describe the positive. Agendas are not always harmful or negative.