Now the X-PERT advice is low carb, high fat

[AndBreathe]

I have to express a difference of opinion with this dietdoctor book:-

1) i have been size 8/10 for 40+ years and only once put on any weight.. When being advised to eat porridge ir toast for breakfast.

2) I have a friend in a eating disorder unit and she is being absolutely stuffed with carb laden foof to put on weight. I mean total carb overload and their plan is working because the carbs are making her crave more carbs. There has been no education on a healthy diet just a total carb overload constantly. Thats a way for sure to put on 3stone in 9 weeks!!!!

3) as for most people NOT being overweight not worrying about healthy food? Absolute tosh... I for one always consider only eating good, proper food. So do my few other lean friends that aren't overweight. Its the larger friends that constantly stuff takeaways every single night and drink etc.

4) i was speaking to a member of WW this week. They have young ladies that don't even know how to cook and had no basic education during their teenage years from either parents or schools on nutrition or cooking.

I at least had home economics when I was at school as did my brothers and hubby. It appears that even these basic skills and learning are not given nowadays.

I would wager that your friend's HCPs will be focusing on dealing with her underlying, toot cause issues, rather than a longer term eating plan. Her disease is rarely anything to do with a lack of appetite, a lack of ability to eat or lack of nutritional understanding. If they don't tackle the root cause, or causes, all the knowledge in the world is unlikely to prevent her relapsing.

It's a cruel, cruel condition not to be viewed superficially or simplistically.

Apologies for deviating from the topic.

 

[donnellysdogs]

I would wager that your friend's HCPs will be focusing on dealing with her underlying, toot cause issues, rather than a longer term eating plan. Her disease is rarely anything to do with a lack of appetite, a lack of ability to eat or lack of nutritional understanding. If they don't tackle the root cause, or causes, all the knowledge in the world is unlikely to prevent her relapsing.

It's a cruel, cruel condition not to be viewed superficially or simplistically.

Apologies for deviating from the topic.

Agree. Unfortunately she getting the extra weight but personally I see a revolving door as issues on causes are not improved at all...

Sorry for diverting.. Just stating really that seeing such massive increase in weight in short time throughlarge qtys of carbs and her now actually feeling hungry is proof of weight gain through carbs. I say massive amounts of carbs.. In actual fact it will just probably be an average days food for many persons diabetic or not.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

I have to express a difference of opinion with this dietdoctor book:-

1) i have been size 8/10 for 40+ years and only once put on any weight.. When being advised to eat porridge ir toast for breakfast.

2) I have a friend in a eating disorder unit and she is being absolutely stuffed with carb laden foof to put on weight. I mean total carb overload and their plan is working because the carbs are making her crave more carbs. There has been no education on a healthy diet just a total carb overload constantly. Thats a way for sure to put on 3stone in 9 weeks!!!!

3) as for most people NOT being overweight not worrying about healthy food? Absolute tosh... I for one always consider only eating good, proper food. So do my few other lean friends that aren't overweight. Its the larger friends that constantly stuff takeaways every single night and drink etc.

4) i was speaking to a member of WW this week. They have young ladies that don't even know how to cook and had no basic education during their teenage years from either parents or schools on nutrition or cooking.

I at least had home economics when I was at school as did my brothers and hubby. It appears that even these basic skills and learning are not given nowadays.

I appreciate your reply to my post. I enjoy hearing other's perspectives. To recap, I said that the Diet Doctor says that for underweight (and of course overweight) people, eating a healthy LCHF diet as he describes in his book, will get them to a normal weight. I'm quite happy to address your 4 points:

1) I'm a bit confused. Are you saying you are underweight and failed to become normal weight while eating a LCHF diet? Otherwise, how does your situation conflict with what the DD says?

2) Again I'm confused. What does this have to do with what the Diet Doctor claims? The book includes discussions about how eating a carb heavy diet will increase weight. I don't believe that citing extreme cases of mental or physical disease contradicts what he says, especially since you cite a case where an underweight person regained weight by eating carbs, rather than failed to gain weight on a healthy LCHF diet. Also, if these medical professionals think this is a proper treatment for an eating disorder, I think they are insane!

3) I am referring to most people I know. It's doubtful we have the same circle of friends and acquaintances and as far as I' aware I don't know you. Even if I did, one person who eats only healthy nonprocessed food does not constitute "most" people, since I know more than two. In fact, I have met very few people who don't buy and consume loads of processed foods. When I go to the grocery store the vast majority of people have mostly factory produced packaged food in their carts. To be clear, this is my observation. If where you live most people eat mostly fresh veg and meat and other healthy nonprocessed food, then surely that has nothing to do with my personal observations where I live! Also, I said they don't seem to worry about eating in a healthy manner. Perhaps they do worry about it, but judging by what I see them eat, they don't appear to worry about it.

4) I have no idea what point I tried to make this observation has to do with. However, how would such a person be able to eat a healthy diet? Surely if they can't cook they must survive on takeout and prepackaged processed food? This does not contradict my observation that most people don't eat a healthy diet.

Anyway, I didn't mean to upset you with my observations.

To sum up, in the words of Marcus Aurelius: "Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth."

 

[Amethyst579]

This paper might interest some readers here, it concludes that the low fat dietary guidelines issued in the late 70's early 80's were not based on robust evidence. http://openheart.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000196 http://openheart.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000196.full.pdf+html

 

[IanD]

The latest email from the organiser of the Hounslow support group includes:

Lynn’s talk was followed by Ian Day who introduced a publication called “Eat Fat” by Dr Trudy Deakin. The summary her views and how she formulated them can read on Line. Please follow the link below: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...carbs-fuelling-obesity-diabetes-epidemic.html

You can purchase her book on line and it costs £9.99. There was an debate on a low carbohydrate diet and I would say that this was the highlight of the evening.​

The next meeting is this evening Feb. 24th at Montague Hall from 7 pm.

 

[Heathenlass]

The latest email from the organiser of the Hounslow support group includes:

Lynn’s talk was followed by Ian Day who introduced a publication called “Eat Fat” by Dr Trudy Deakin. The summary her views and how she formulated them can read on Line. Please follow the link below: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...carbs-fuelling-obesity-diabetes-epidemic.html

You can purchase her book on line and it costs £9.99. There was an debate on a low carbohydrate diet and I would say that this was the highlight of the evening.​

The next meeting is this evening Feb. 24th at Montague Hall from 7 pm.

Excellent ! I'd be really interested if you learn that any attendees changed their diet and or bought the book as a result .

Signy

 

[Paul59]

There was this in the Daily mail earlier this month.
'By scaring us off butter health chiefs have made us fatter' writes JOHN NAISH | Daily Mail Online, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...er-ve-fatter-unhealthy-writes-JOHN-NAISH.html

 

[Heathenlass]

I wonder just how long it will take to reverse the current dietry advice given that the NHS moves exceedingly slowly, and staff will need to be retrained. I'm also curious about what impact it will have in the USA, especially as suing people and organisations seems to be almost a national sport ?

Signy

 

[Paul59]

Yes it'll be interesting to see on both parts.
As for the retraining who will train them cause it only seems to be X-Pert healthy that are moving forward & unless the Nhs buy in then then things will stay the same with them.

 

[Heathenlass]

Yes it'll be interesting to see on both parts.
As for the retraining who will train them cause it only seems to be X-Pert healthy that are moving forward & unless the Nhs buy in then then things will stay the same with them.

Good point - I know that many areas are contracted to use DAFNE for Type 1's and that format isn't going to change any time soon ! But the hospitals that have devised their own diabetic education courses can be much more flexible and adaptable . It's just the mindset of the educators that will need to change first, and the whole lot of us has been indoctrinated for so **** long it bothers me that in the last week I've seen several newly diagnosed members express shock and disbelief on being told that actually, low fat this and low fat that will do them more harm in the long run .

I'm looking forward to seeing my sister at the next family meet up , for years she has been giving my father grief for what she calls his " heart attack on a plate" fried breakfasts. He's eaten the same breakfast all of his life, is 87 years old and fit as a lop !

Signy

 

[IanD]

A lady I spoke to at last night's meeting will go on an X-PERT course next Friday. I gave her a look at my copy of "Eat Fat" & the link. She is from an organisation supporting diabetics & came to the meeting with a view to addressing the meeting on a future occasion.

 

[pavlovsdog]

Yes it'll be interesting to see on both parts.
As for the retraining who will train them cause it only seems to be X-Pert healthy that are moving forward & unless the Nhs buy in then then things will stay the same with them.

I suspect the NHS will eventually introduce it as an 'option' rather than a recommendation, which will also avoid the chance of litigation

 

[Heathenlass]

I suspect the NHS will eventually introduce it as an 'option' rather than a recommendation, which will also avoid the chance of litigation

Yes, I think you are right. The potential embarrassment of doing an about turn though ! I'd just like to hear the bluff and bluster but we've been here before on a lesser scale :

" Eat eggs. They're good for you ! In fact, go to work on an egg !"

" No. No eggs. Way baaaad for your cholesterol" Maybe egg white omelettes . Once a month "

" Eggs are fine ! They won't affect your cholesterol , chock full of protein and vitamins! "

" Your cholesterol is high. Eat eggs. And I recommend a course of leeches, while we are at it...."


Signy

 

[Spiker]

Leeches ftw

 

[IanD]

Yes, I think you are right.
......
And I recommend a course of leeches, while we are at it...."

Signy

That is a really good suggestion!

Also maggot therapy

 

[sally and james]

Leeches, maggots: all low carb. Recommend taking with cream
sally

 

[IanD]

Leeches, maggots: all low carb. Recommend taking with cream
sally

As a moderator, I'm not sure this is in good taste, but bearing in mind their preferred diet, I hesitate to include maggots in my diet.

I did once complain about the quantity of green flies on the lettuce, "the lettuce hasn't been washed." She took it away & brought it back washed, but still covered in green flies. They tasted like lettuce because of their healthy salad diet.

Likewise, apple maggots are OK in principle, but I still avoid them.

 

[CollieBoy]

Seriously maggots have a valid place in treatment of necrotic tissue.

 

[Miilanna]

The LCHF diet for diabetics does not mean "Adkins" Diet (thank goodness). Fat in the diet does not cause high cholesterol, carbs do.

 

[zand]

The LCHF diet for diabetics does not mean "Adkins" Diet (thank goodness). Fat in the diet does not cause high cholesterol, carbs do.

Yes that's what I have found too.