Are we reurning to 'normal' too quickly.

[DCUKMod]

I've been golfing but as others have said it is quite different to "normal". Obviously we drive separately rather than share lifts, pay online and no use of club house or changing rooms. We don't tend to stay as far apart as we did first round back but that day we were probably about 50 feet apart!! No rakes in bunkers, no ball washers and various contraptions in the hole so you just lift your ball out easily! When we finish we use the Mr Spock Vulcan salute rather than a hand shake!! The one thing I won't do which I did before is eat a sandwich on the course!!

On the other hand I am still working from home, which was a good decision as within a week or so from the school opening again with more students and staff a teacher tested positive for Covid so the school is back on the virtual timetable and only taking the basic children of key workers and vulnerable.

I've a big decision come September as I am sure they will probably open properly then! I certainly won't however visit pubs, cinemas, theatres etc until the day where hopefully a vaccine or treatment makes it all easier to cope with. Might be in for a long wait!

I think in many ways it's all opening too quickly but at the same time I understand it's all about the economy! What I find bizarre though is queues for Primark or other unessential shops, I mean where at the moment would you wear a new dress?!

If you are feeling safer playing golf, and being at the golf club, what will you do when the clubhouse reopens, and brings back access to changing facilities, loos and hospitality facilities?

 

[Max68]

If you are feeling safer playing golf, and being at the golf club, what will you do when the clubhouse reopens, and brings back access to changing facilities, loos and hospitality facilities?

I'm lucky that my friends are aware of my "risk" so as I say we pay online and one of our party pops in to the shop to hand over the booking. We aren't members anywhere so rarely in the past went in to the clubhouse anyway bar drinks and loos. Now I take own drink and will have a pee in some secluded bushes if required and wipe hands down with sanitizer when the round has finished.

Indoors I am very wary. Needed a new kettle but Argos won't do a click and collect outside like Sainsbury Groceries do so just ordered one for delivery from Robert Dyas!

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

On a related topic, I wonder how guide dogs will get on when they start going out again. Will retraining be required?

 

[Tannith]

I'm lucky that my friends are aware of my "risk" so as I say we pay online and one of our party pops in to the shop to hand over the booking. We aren't members anywhere so rarely in the past went in to the clubhouse anyway bar drinks and loos. Now I take own drink and will have a pee in some secluded bushes if required and wipe hands down with sanitizer when the round has finished.

Indoors I am very wary. Needed a new kettle but Argos won't do a click and collect outside like Sainsbury Groceries do so just ordered one for delivery from Robert Dyas!

It's your job to do whatever you think necessary to keep yourself covid free. And my job to do what I think necessary for myself. It's Boris' job to prevent the NHS from being overwhelmed. He doesn't care about any of us as individuals, we are just statistics to him. I shall not be coming out of lockdown until I think it is safe for me. I don't care what the Govt says. We must all look after ourselves. Boris won't be looking after us.

 

[lindisfel]

As does coming on a forum and stating the blindingly obvious, but if you do not come into contact with the virus at all there is no risk of being infected by it, this would be very difficult but not impossible.

I find it odd, John, that people do not understand the simple concept of relative risk!
I would much sooner fry an egg, perhaps even three eggs, than play Russian roulette.

Sending the at risk and older members of society into pubs, so they can spend us out of this recession may be a Johnson idea, but home fried eggs and bacon suit me just fine.
Next time, if I burn my fingers, I'll get the better half to do the cooking and be careful when I put the fork in my mouth and try not choke on crispy done bacon.

What a really silly argument, every action has risks, is!
D.

 

[lindisfel]

You bet, if Trump and that madman who is burning the Amazon, get "the little sniffles" they will have the best expert doctors in the world on their cases from day 1.
In this post lockdown world with 20,000 new cases every week we need to work out what's best for ourselves and families.
D.

 

[Max68]

@Tannith @lindisfel Agree with both of you. It's all about the economy now and individuals are merely collateral to Boris and his cronies. I find it hard to understand how a pint at the pub or watching a movie in a cinema is more important than avoiding the virus, especially considering the recent articles suggesting that quite a high proportion of "recovered" cases are suffering effects weeks and months after "recovering"!

I'm hopeful that in my personal life I can substantially reduce my risk of contracting Covid by doing what I have been doing. However come September I cannot see how I can control my risk in my professional life when my work from home agreement finishes and I am expected back at the school. In many ways I'd rather risk financial issues by going on Universal Credit than risk my health and stay in the job but if you resign then you can't claim Universal Credit!! A quandary that many are going to be faced with in the coming weeks I fear.

 

[bulkbiker]

Sending the at risk and older members of society into pubs

But no-one is "sending" anyone into a pub... they will be open if you want to visit.

 

[There is no Spoon]

simple concept of relative risk!

I agree completely family meals are always risky.
Christmas is the worst.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Even boiling an egg comes with risk attached.. burning yourself or the house down..

Yeah, just not feeling it.
Your gonna have to up the anti if you want to get it green lit as a show on Netflix, can I suggest a kitchen floor covered in mouse traps a blindfolded cook and the house set up next door to a puppy shelter.

Now that's Entertainment.

 

[Monty19]

Some ten or 15 years ago (so the details are now a bit vague), I went on a risk assessment course. Basically you assess the likelihood of something happening, giving it a score of 1 to 4 (1 = highly unlikely, 4 = very likely) and similarly to assess the damage that would be done if the event occurred (1 = minor injury, 4 = dead). Multiply the answers to get your risk and consider if something should be done or behaviour altered.
As far as Covid is concerned, I live in a windy area, by the sea, where I would need to meet around 1,000 people to find someone infectious. I would struggle, most days, to meet 10 and almost none of them would be close contact. Likelihood score = 1. I'm female, white, in good metabolic health and in my 60's, so feel that I am unlikely to be in the "Dead" or probably even the "nearly dead" category, so, having multiplied the answers, I feel that I have nothing to get too concerned about.
We should each make our own assessments, depending on health and where and how we live. Nobody has to play golf, walk on the sea front, chat to the neighbours, but those who feel that fresh air and social contact are important to them, should be encouraged and allowed to get on with, after all, these are vital for both physical and mental health.
As a society, we are not doing it too fast, it should be up to the individual.
Sally

 

[Jamie H]

I think, as expressed before, there is going to be a a wide range of approaches here dependant on risk... The concept of no risk isn't really an option.. Even those shielding have began venturing out.. Which isn't a criticism and a great sign and good for mental health.

I don't view myself as invincible.. But I try my best so let the science of risk lead my decision making rather than fear... I do fail at times as I am only human and the virus and what it can do to even the healthiest of people does scare me a lot at times.

The science indicates, given my own personal circumstances that I am, even as a type 1 diabetic, at lower risk than someone in their mid 40s who is perfectly healthy... That's based on the risk calculator I posted previously and Dr kar's study. On that basis I continue to be careful but will go to shops and I am booked into a hotel in July and God willing will be able to enjoy a pint of guinness in the bar when I am there. With that comes responsibility and I will ensure I stay distant to people and practise good hand hygeine etc.

This is not some sanctimonious post as I know there are many in a position who have higher risk factors and I am lucky I am in a position to make that personal decision... As I said I don't do so with the illusion that I am invincible and could well become very ill or worse if I contracted covid... So could someone who is at less risk than myself... I try as best I can to do so based on risk.. As none of us can do anything differently (base decisions on risk, rather than outcome) until there is a vaccine.

I don't think any differing of position either way should be shamed and it's all about using this community to pull each other through this awful time.

 

[Jamie H]

I'd like to also say.. That as someone who has elderly parents... Any decisions are based around maintaining strict social distancing from them.. I talk a lot about personal risk but from the outset I have been doing their shopping and refused until lately to even step inside into a different floor of the house (permitted now in NI)... it's not just about our own risk but that we pose to others we love.

If and when contact is allowed.. A hug from my mother and father will beat a trip to a hotel or a thousand pints of guinness every time.

 

[KK123]

Everybody is different and their approach to 'risky' endeavours throughout their lives will be different too, regardless of what health condition we may or may not have. I don't think our personalities change much over the course of our lives so if you have always been someone who is more cautious then you always will be, relative of course to whatever situation is in front of you. This means (in normal times) you will barely consider anyone else's risk in relation to your own because, well, they are not YOU. Because of that though we DO rely on the govt and their scientific advisors to give us logical, researched and relevant information and advice to follow when something is abroad that may affect others if you decide to ignore it, otherwise it would be a free for all, a do as you like, don't worry about others and so on. It's easy to say 'don't go to the pub' and you don't have to but you DO have to go to work (or get sacked) or go out to get food (or starve) or go to see your family etc.

 

[Alexandra100]

I don't want any risk.

Me too!

 

[Fairygodmother]

Having watched yesterday’s govt update broadcast I’m going to take more notice of what Whitty and Vallance were saying than the news that we can now go to the pub. And no, I don’t feel guilty that I won’t be supporting businesses; we’re spending more on food now we shop online and have it delivered (hope that’s still possible if things need to be locked down again). I do feel sorry though for all the small businesses that have suffered from lack of passing trade, and the hotels, theatres and cafes that are going to the wall.
However, if you look at the history of plagues, they bring a lot of misery and social distress with them.
In the meantime I feel we should get through this stretch as best we can, and for me that means not doing things that might harm others as well as considering myself and my family, and do our best to support those who’ve been harmed by it.

 

[Steve_UK]

Iv never stopped working right through 'Self Isolation'
March to now must have been the busiest Iv ever been as a bathroom fitter and Iv still got months worth of work booked in. It has been crazy but not been at the footy 3-4 times a week Iv saved loads aswell

'Self Isolation' has definitely been lifted too early. You look at the figures and we have one of the highest death rates. Our government have dealt with it so badly. We needed a full lockdown like other countries but we failed to do that as the government wanted money to still be ticking over in certain sectors.

People like my mate have had it and he didn't even have one symptom but only got tested as his work shut down with others getting it and the factory having to shut for 2 weeks cleaning and staff testing.

How can you say lockdown has been lifted too early when you have worked through out it? Surely if that was the case you too would have stopped work back in March to protect yourself, or is the need to earn a crust greater for you than the rest of the country? Double standards it seems!

 

[lucylocket61]

I think the message from Dr whitty is much more cautious than the message from Boris, but Boris's voice is heard more, so more people will do what he says, not heeding the caveats from Dr whitty.

Wales is not reducing lockdown yet.

 

[Chook]

On a related topic, I wonder how guide dogs will get on when they start going out again. Will retraining be required?

I read an article about this - apparently the older more experienced dogs will remember their training but younger dogs more recently trained are more likely to forget and might need a refresher course.

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

I read an article about this

It's funny how blinkered I was when considering problems (I really don't have any), when so many others have so many different issues to consider. Lets hope that people realise that some animals might have some issues. I usually give guide dogs plenty of room despite having an overall urge to make a fuss of the animal, they're absolutely brilliant.