Is vitamin B12 really necessary

[wozey]

Hi been advised by a friend with type 2 to take vitamin B12 as a precaution to prevent serious side effects to the Metformin. I googled it and wish I didn’t but it seemed to suggest the treatment for this would be B12 injections not a tablet, so I’m interested what you guys think because if the treatment is injections then why take the pills

 

[Lamont D]

Yes, especially at this time of the year!

 

[Rachox]

I’ve taken Metformin for nearly six years, I take a vitamin B complex tablet daily (which includes B12) and ask my GP to include vitamin B 12 levels every couple of years. So far my levels have been fine. If they had been without the supplements I don’t know. I know if you do become deficient the treatment is by injection.

 

[Antje77]

Hi been advised by a friend with type 2 to take vitamin B12 as a precaution to prevent serious side effects to the Metformin. I googled it and wish I didn’t but it seemed to suggest the treatment for this would be B12 injections not a tablet, so I’m interested what you guys think because if the treatment is injections then why take the pills

When I was on metformin I simply asked for my B12 to be tested along with my hba1c, not everyone develops a deficiency with metformin.

 

[CatsFive]

Yes, especially at this time of the year!

I know vitamin D supplements are a good idea in winter, had no idea B12 was.

 

[Oldvatr]

B12 is not necesssary, it is Essential, Without it we cannot make haemoglobin '(red blood cells) Taking a supplement when on long term Metformin is advised but not normally required if you follow an omnivore diet since animal foods will supply the normal daily requirement, If you are vegetarian or vegan or macrobiotic then yes,supplements are required. Injections are used when oral supplementation is insuffiicient.

 

[Sarah69]

I’ve been on metformin a long time I’ve never been told to take supplements or vitamins.

 

[Oldvatr]

I’ve been on metformin a long time I’ve never been told to take supplements or vitamins.

Does not mean you shouldnt have been warned about this. The NICE guidelins for Metformin are clear, and the BNF has Important Information for prescriber and patients.

Metformin hydrochloride | Drugs | BNF content published by NICE

View metformin hydrochloride information, including dose, uses, side-effects, renal impairment, pregnancy, breast feeding, contra-indications and monitoring requirements.

bnf.nice.org.uk

B12 tests have to be arranged spcifically and are expensive, so GP's are reluctant to order them. Usually they only do so when a problem shows up. But they should still be giving out info regarding symtoms to be aware of.

Vitamin B12 or folate deficiency anaemia symptoms and treatments

Vitamin B12 or B9 (folate) deficiency anaemia causes the body to produce abnormally large red blood cells. Learn about anaemia symptoms and treatments.

www.nhsinform.scot

It is not an in your face condition, but by the time problems are diagnosed, it is usually too late, and injections are needed.

Omnivores eating red meat are usually getting B12 naturally and it is generally not a problem. It is more common in vegetarians and especially vegans. Our bodies do not make B12 and we hve to have a regular income to stay healthy. Metformin reduces the oral potential.

 

[jjraak]

Hi been advised by a friend with type 2 to take vitamin B12 as a precaution to prevent serious side effects to the Metformin. I googled it and wish I didn’t but it seemed to suggest the treatment for this would be B12 injections not a tablet, so I’m interested what you guys think because if the treatment is injections then why take the pills

Edit to add movie link
HERE

I only found out a good while after being DX as T2D, about the dangers of B12 depletion thanks to the forum.

It is actually on the leaflet inside the Metformin packet that it's a risk ....but I hadn't bothered to read it ..


Anyway, I asked to be tested,
Result came back
Range is around 200-900..and I was pulling 243.

Began supplementing with tablets
(Sub lingual recommended as it bypasses stomach acids)

( Do vaguely remember reading this version offers similar benefits to the injections ?...but I'd have to Google that for a source
Link here suggests not
But it does have a lot of other information about B12 )

My latest scores was mid 400.

Did have serious accident, where eating LCHF was interrupted for over a year as I recovered, so can't say for certain the supplemental B12 was definitely the reason, but I'd rather have tried it then risk the consequences.

I read B12 depletion is also normal as we age, 60 I think being the age decline increases.

I now consider finding out about it a lucky bonus, as with T2D on Metformin I can request a test each year to monitor mine.

There's a link under my signature of a B movie about how low B12 can be misdiagnosed as other ailments & it's impact.

Worth a watch (think murder she wrote ) and very informative

True story to boot, of a nurse who spotted the real condition affecting each patient.

 

[jjraak]

Just an addition to above post

For anyone with test results but not the B12 one

The link posted above mentions MCV values being raised as indicative of a B12 lowering

My test for B12 were low & lower.
The corresponding test for my MCV was high & higher.

Might be helpful if pushing for a test at GPs

Mine had no problem with my request to test .
Other Surgeries may differ.

 

[Mbaker]

If you get remission of Type 2 consider removing the drug. Your liver if working correctly will do the job by itself.

 

[Outlier]

Recently 2 people in my social circle were rushed to hospital with severe anaemia, and both were found extremely B12 deficient also. One was diabetic and on several meds including Metformin, one wasn't and on no meds at all. The T2 person followed an abysmal diet, the other a varied and healthy omnivore diet. Each is elderly.

So - it isn't just diabetes. Maybe B12 deficiency is a risk that increases with old age as well. I take a supplement, and my B12 levels are checked along with Hb1ac, though that's just once a year now.

 

[TriciaWs]

I have recurrent issues with folate deficiency (B9) and my GP is supposed to test for B12 at the same time before treating it. They don't.
However, they helpfully tell me to eat green veg (I already do).
Some time ago, when the experts were telling us we didn't need organic food, research showed organic eggs have more B12 than caged eggs. It was dismissed as no one needed B12 supplements - not true of course.

 

[jjraak]

So - it isn't just diabetes. Maybe B12 deficiency is a risk that increases with old age as well. I take a supplement, and my B12 levels are checked along with Hb1ac, though that's just once a year now.

Indeed, the link I posted and many others point to 60 being the turning point .

In fact, I remember reading that after 6 months old until 60 years old we keep a certain level of nutrient levels, and it's only after 60 it all begins to decline .

 

[jjraak]

I have recurrent issues with folate deficiency (B9) and my GP is supposed to test for B12 at the same time before treating it. They don't.
However, they helpfully tell me to eat green veg (I already do).
Some time ago, when the experts were telling us we didn't need organic food, research showed organic eggs have more B12 than caged eggs. It was dismissed as no one needed B12 supplements - not true of course.

I wonder if the video I posted would be of use ?

See 12:40
Here

Mention is importantly made of B9 being added to cereal, and that addition masking any B12 deficiency...mmhh

And B12 not being available in vegetables, but you likely know that.

 

[Mini Dachs Mum]

Any one can have a B12 deficiency as especially we age it becomes more common. In Australia cattle are injected with B12 before they are killed to make sure their levels are high. As a vegan I take B12 daily and have good levels.