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Loads of conflicting info - advice needed

Discussion in 'Type 2 Diabetes' started by AdviceSought, Feb 11, 2013.

  1. AdviceSought

    AdviceSought · Member

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    Read so much different views on things, some of which contradict what my GP told me.

    Anyway, I have been told I am early stages type 2 and my first priority is to get my weight down, and then report back in 3 months to see if I will be put on tablets or not, so what I have been doing is simply trying to watch calories and ensure I exercise a bit.

    However, I have been reading some fruits are fine, others aren't.

    Some say nuts are fine others don't.

    Some say potatoes are fine, others don't, it's all very confusing.

    Most of the fruit I have been eating are apples, grapes, pineapples, blueberries, strawberries, plums and pears.

    Can anyone advise which of these I should avoid?

    I eat quite a bit of baked potatoes, which apparently have a lot of carbs - I don't have filling with them, just a small bit of flora lite over them.

    Am I also better replacing normal sausages when I have them with Quorn ones?

    I am still awaiting seeing a dietician, so any advice on the issues I have raised above will be greatly received.
     
  2. Robinredbreast

    Robinredbreast Type 1 · Oracle

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    Hello and welcome :wave:

    I am not type 2, but I'm sure someone will be along soon to help you out. I do know that a lot of type 2's steer clear of fruits, rice, bread, cereals and pasta as these are full of carbs, some foods will make your BS rise,but with other people, it may not make a huge difference in BS.

    Best wishes RRB
     
  3. ))Denise((

    ))Denise(( Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    The advice for a Type 2 is to restrict the amount of carbohydrate you eat as they will raise your blood sugar. The main culprits are sugar, flour (so this includes pastry, cakes, batters, breaded coatings), bread, pasta, rice and potatoes. You need to replace the carbs with something else so this includes meat, fish, dairy and eggs. Vegetables that grow above ground are good as are fruits that end with berry. Nuts are good as they are low carb. Bananas, grapes and pineapple are usually bad.

    A good website that explains this is http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf

    Some sausages are quite high carb, you have to look at the label, but the ones marked over 85% meat are usually ok, so no need to replace them with Quorn.

    The dietician unless enlightened, will probably toe the party line and suggest having carbs with every meal. This is unnecessary and will raise your blood sugar.

    Daisy will be along in the morning to give you the welcome to new members,
     
  4. terrie2k9

    terrie2k9 · Member

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    I have the same problem I have just been diagnosed and don't know if I'm coming or going with it all so any advice would be usefully to me to thanks guys
     
  5. ewelina

    ewelina Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Avoid carbs especially processed. Go for pulses,quinoa,brown rice/pasta but still in moderation. Check glycemic index and you will learn what carbs you can eat. Avoid fruits (only berries in moderation). There is a lot of info here so search the forum. Good luck :)
     
  6. Yorksman

    Yorksman Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    The very general advice about food is to avoid sweets, buns, biscuits, chocolate bars etc and refined carbs like white bread. Many people avoid white bread but eat wholegrain bread for example. Same with rice, switch from white to brown rice. If you have pasta, go for wholegrain pasta.

    If your doctor is waiting and seeing for three months, I would do more than 'exercise a bit'. Cutting down your carn intake helps but so does improving your insulin sensitivity. That helps lower the glucose in your blood. Regular exrcise during the day is best. Just short bits, enough to make you feel you have done something, walk up a hill or some flights of steps. It is better than a 30 min session every two days for example. Exercise causes various hormones or enzymes to be released into the blood stream but the effect is short lived, a couple of days maybe. Several short periods, say 5 mins in a day helps reduce whatever carbs you have eaten during meals but, you have to somehow find the time. Small things help like using the stairs rather than a lift or walking to the shops. It takes two or three weeks to kick in but it does help.

    On the subject of fruits, look at relative glycemic index. http://www.livestrong.com/article/27838 ... or-fruits/
     
  7. daisy1

    daisy1 Type 2 · Legend
    Retired Moderator

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    Hi AdviceSought and Terrie and welcome to the forum :)

    This information we give to new members should be useful to you. Carry on asking questions and more people will be along to help.


    BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

    Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

    A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you’ll find well over 30,000 people who are demonstrating this.

    On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

    The role of carbohydrate

    Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

    If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

    The bad news

    Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

    The good news

    People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

    Controlling your carbs

    The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
    There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

    • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
    • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
    Reduce your carbohydrates

    A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

    The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

    Choosing better carbohydrates

    Another option is to replace ‘white carbohydrates’ (such as white bread, white rice, white flour etc) with whole grain varieties. The idea behind having whole grain varieties is that the carbohydrates get broken down slower than the white varieties –and these are said to have a lower glycaemic index.
    http://www.diabetes.co.uk/food/diabetes ... rains.html

    The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

    Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes

    Eating what works for you

    Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

    To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

    The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

    Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
    • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
    Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
    • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
    Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
    • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
    However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

    Access to blood glucose test strips
    The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

    • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
    • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

    Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

    You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic

    Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
     
  8. AdviceSought

    AdviceSought · Member

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    Thanks for the responses.

    Have started checking carb levels on labels. What kind of % on them should be ok?

    Also, why are there two carb listings, the second being of which sugars.

    I have managed to lose around 12 to 13 lbs since my first fasting blood test and I know that unlike in the past I will keep going now.

    Probably the largest carb intake for me is the baked potatoes.

    I don't eat much white bread. Any sandwiches at lunchtime, which i make myself rather than than buy are wholemeal/wholegrain.
     
  9. hanadr

    hanadr · Expert

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    Advice Sought
    If you have always eaten freely then a modified Atkins diet as the info on this board describes, is very likely to work quickly to normalise your blood sugar and get your weight down. Forget everything you've ever read about carbohydrates being essential to health; they aren't!
    If you are really interested, try reading Gary Taubes's " The diet deception" and Dr, John Briffa's on-line blog.
    simply counting Calories doesn't work well.
    Hana
     
  10. sw11bloke

    sw11bloke · Well-Known Member

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    from your posting Advicesought, It seems that you have not been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes just yet.

    You talk about getting your weight down.... Many people who are over weight are at risk of type 2 diabetes so perhaps this is why you have been given this information.

    I would not panicj just yet if I were you. Focus on excercise and eating healthy. Try do an 30-40mins walking or jogging each day. Drink at least 8 glasses of water a day. Change to brown rice, wholemeal pasta, wholemeal breads. Keep starchy carbs to a minimum. Eat more lean proteins, and vegetables that grow above the ground. Limit your portions of fruit as they have alot of sugar. Stay away from juices and alcohol for a while and I am sure that in a few months, you will feel as healthy as.

    It is clear that a change of lifestyle is needed.
     
  11. AdviceSought

    AdviceSought · Member

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    I had fasting blood tests in January that had raised levels.

    Doc said he thinks I am early stages type 2 (had no symptoms at all) and he will take me back in 3 months for another test and then decide if I need medication for it or not.

    When I last saw him (after 2nd blood test) I was asked to provide a urine sample, then had to provide a 2nd one as the first showed a high level of protein.

    Going back to see the doctor to follow up on that in the next week.

    My blood pressure has been raised.
     
  12. the east man

    the east man · Well-Known Member

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    When I'm checking carbs, I always try and go no higher than 5% carbs per 100 grams
     
  13. AdviceSought

    AdviceSought · Member

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    Just had a read of the NHS Scotland My Diabetes, My Way website and this seems to contradict a lot of what I've read elsewhere:

    For instance, I was under the impression bread, potatoes, grapes etc were not ideal.

    :?
     
  14. viviennem

    viviennem Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Sadly, for many Type 2s who are on diet only or minimal medication, the NHS dietary advice is just about completely wrong. It would work for any diabetic who is injecting insulin because they are able to take enough insulin to cover their carbohydrates. Most of us Type 2s can't do that, and don't produce enough insulin (or it doesn't work well) to deal with our carbs correctly, so we have to work on keeping our blood glucose levels down by diet. All the carbohydrate we eat turns into glucose in our blood - my theory is, if you don't want high blood glucose, don't eat carbohydrates!

    I was diagnosed in April 2010 with early Type 2 (if there is such a thing!) - ie, my blood glucose levels were raised but I had no symptoms whatsoever. I had (and still have :oops: ) a lot of weight to lose. I use a slightly modified version of Atkins Induction which is a Sticky Thread on the Low-carb section of this forum - (Viv's Modified Atkins Diet). Have a look at it; it's a very-low-carb diet, and gives a good list of low-carb veg to get your 5-a-day from. Most of the foods you list above would send my blood glucose too high; this includes grapes and bananas; I can cope with the odd small apple or satsuma, and I do eat berries in the summer, with cream to offset the carbs :D .

    If you are not eating carbohydrates, or eating a small amount only, you need to replace the calories with something else. Natural fats are okay on a very-low-carb diet, because if your body can't burn carbohydrate it will burn fat instead. You don't need to gorge on fat; just don't avoid it.

    When I am following this diet properly I lose weight (60lbs gone so far), and I can keep my blood glucose levels always within the non-diabetic range. Just for an experiment (and out of sheer self-indulgence!) I have added more carbohydrate to my diet since Christmas - I am eating up to about 150/180 grams of carbohydrate daily instead of my low-carb diet total of less than 50g and preferably around 30g.

    I have put on about 6lbs in weight, and my daily blood glucose readings are still within the Type 2 target range, but are up from always below 5.6 to anything between about 5 up to 7. My next HbA1c is due at the end of March, and the comparison with my last one is going to be very interesting! But day-to-day, eating more carbohydrate - and I am not eating the Recommended Daily Allowance by any means - increases my blood glucose readings and is bad for my diabetes.

    Having said all that in favour of low-carb - you mentioned in an earlier post that your GP had found protein in your urine. With Atkins Induction, one naturally ends up eating more protein than "normal"; this may not be good for you. You need to discuss it with your GP; make sure you get the facts. Unfortunately many GPs are not in favour of low-carbing. Tell him/her that you would like to control your carbohydrate intake to manage your blood glucose levels, and see what the response is.

    Rather than very low carb, you might be better off on a carbohydrate level of about 100g per day, with strict portion control. Go for Low Glycaemic Index carbs - wholemeal or seedy bread, one or two new potatoes, a small serving of brown rice or wholemeal pasta. Get yourself a carb counter book so you can check on the amount of carbs in your food - available from all good bookshops or Amazon. Most of them have GI readings as well. High GI foods, eg the soft inside of a baked potato, can raise your blood glucose as fast as sugar - as can white bread :shock: .

    Ask you doctor to give you a blood glucose monitor and test strips on prescription; it is the greatest tool for learning which foods you can and can't eat. You'll test most at first; later, when you know what you can and can't eat, you'll need fewer strips. It's much cheaper for the NHS for you to get good control in the beginning, than to ignore things and maybe get complications later.

    I seem to have rambled on a bit, but I hope I've answered you questions. If not, I'll try again - just keep asking! :D

    Viv 8)
     
  15. bigbenn

    bigbenn · Member

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    Hi,
    Speaking for myself, when I got Diabetes Type 2 about 5 years ago, I quickly decided that I did not want it and I would do whatever it took to reverse it and get rid of it altogether.
    I can't speak for the rest of you, but in many cases, it seems to me, having Diabetes type 2 or even Type 1 is a lifestyle choice and many of you won't make the change I did to get rid of Diabetes altogether.
    Is it possible to reverse Diabetes and return to a 6.1 or lower blood sugar reading - well, I had no problem doing so, over 3 years ago, Diabetes free now and, if I can, for the rest of my life.
    For me, it all came down to diet and exercise, although I've been lazy with the exercise of late.
    Read this link, in particular follow the links at the bottom of the article: You Did NOT Eat Your Way to Diabetes. The REAL Causes.
    For myself, I created this diet for myself over 4 years ago and have been Diabetes free now for over 3 years and counting....
    If you take medication prescribed by your Doctor, continue to do so.

    My diet below, is simple and effective when you fast walk, for 20 plus minutes, daily, as well, which is a must and you lose weight automatically, you simply can’t help yourself from doing so.

    In the medical updates which I have read with interest, it seems that my diet is also a way of protecting my body against heart and brain related diseases, especially as I get older than my 65 years.

    The lighter you, the better control over your Diabetes and the longer your life.

    I settled on the enclosed diet of 2,500 Calories each day.
    Breakfast:
    2 x eggs raw.
    2 serves of 2 biscuits of Weetbix = 4
    1 Tablespoon of low fat dried milk powder, mixed with water, or low fat milk.
    3 pieces of fruit (Advocado, Apple & a Banana) I liquidise the fruit into a smoothie which I drink with my tablets – prior to my morning fast walk.

    Snack 10am (after the daily morning walk).
    Handful of nuts
    1 piece of fruit,
    Sticks of Celery.
    Mug of water

    Lunch 12.30 pm
    1 x 130g to 200g can of raw fish in brine: Salmon, Herring, Sardines, Mackerel, Tuna, etc
    1 x piece of fruit, as above.
    Mug of water

    Afternoon snack
    2 mugs of juiced carrots with Apple or celery sticks.
    Piece of fruit, as above
    Mug of water

    Dinner:
    Usual meal, minimise portions to reduce amount of food the body needs, however without salt, fat or sugar related products

    If you enjoy a drink, try to drink sugar free drinks

    I used to get fatigue around 2pm through to about 4pm and could never work out why I always felt tired then. The solution was quite straight forward. Eating the 1 x 130g to 200g can of fish in brine, at lunchtime, recharged my energy banks for most of the afternoon and made me awake and aware of what was happening around me, even when I felt physically tired and that has in itself, changed my life and my enjoyment of life enormously.

    Of course and it goes without saying, I must eat and drink no sugar related products which includes no alcohol of any type and although I have never smoked, giving up smoking, is a must too.

    If you think that giving up alcohol, sugar drinks and smoking is too much – then remember you are doing so for your life and continuing to live for as long as you possibly can vs an unpleasant, slow and perhaps, un-necessary death.

    So what’s the upside? For the last 3 years I have been Diabetes Type 2 free with a normal blood sugar reading of 6.1 from my 3 monthly blood tests. My body organs have regenerated to full health, including my eyes which were failing.

    I am in my mid 60’s and I intend to never have Diabetes Type 2 again.

    I hope my diet and exercise plan, which is simplicity itself and the cure, automatic, will help those of you willing to give it a try and I would be happy to support and encourage everyone willing to give themselves a second chance with my diet, through this forum.

    Updates: Glasses check showed no deterioration for over 2 years now – 20/20 vision
    Drivers Licence extended to 2 years before the next licence renewal – up from 1 year – whooppee
    I remain Diabetes free
    It helps to have a dog for walks and for company and I recommend them to everyone – I have 2 dogs a Retriever and a Labrador. They must be walked daily and so then, must I.
    BigBenn
     
  16. bigbenn

    bigbenn · Member

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    Re above.
    Contact me at [email protected], without the xx's, for the link which is missing.
    BigBenn
     
  17. Cynthia6

    Cynthia6 · Member

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    I went for a blood test today only to be told that I would only have my blood sugar tested once a year, as I am having a lot of problems with my blood sugar levels at night and in the early hours the doctor had told me to have a blood test, the nurse did the blood test but told me that I won't get another one till next year, I was told I had type 2 diabetes in May 2011 and was put on tablets in December 2011 and have lost 2stone 7lbs since then, but my blood sugar is always high till the evening and the early hours when it drops.
    Can anyone help me please
     
  18. Daibell

    Daibell LADA · Master

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    HI. I think the decision depends on what your last/recent HBa1C result was/is. If it's getting near to the NICE guideline limit of 7.5% then your GP should offer a 3 or 6 month repeat HBa1C; I would insist on that if needed and ask to be referred back to your GP or just book to see him. Have a look at the NICE Diabetes Pathways doc on the NICE/NHS website for guidance. It sounds like you may need further tablets added assuming you are on a low-carb diet.
     
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