"new" diagnosis pre diabetes - 42

[muzungu]

Hello folks and just thought I would post my situation which in the great scheme of things is pretty insignificant in comparison to others, but anyway....
Following routine blood test, haven't had one for at least a decade, my GP tells me I have hit the lower pre diabetic A1c of 42 mmol\mol. Everything else fine.

I am 67, non drinker and non smoker and pretty active. This "diagnosis" was about 12 weeks ago now.

I haven't taken up the referral to the "Healthier you" program but after a bit of research feel much more motivated to do it all myself, I am not a "group" person. So upped the exercise routine and have been following a stricter diet for the last 12 weeks. Mainly smaller portions; meat, fish, fresh vegetables and still have carbs in the form of whole wheat bread and pasta, brown rice and such like. Nothing in the way of anything with added sugar and almost nothing processed. Actually quite enjoying it!

Anyway the results after 12 weeks.

Lost 7 kg so just over a stone and I am now firmly in the green zone on the BMI charts, and yes I know the shortcomings of BMI but it's an indication. 3 kilos yet to go to my target.
In the last 4 weeks I have been testing one day a week, fasting (11 hours morning test) and then in the evening post main meal. I have been using the Accu-Chek Instant system.

mmol\l - Fasting - Post meal (2 hours)
Week 9: 5.9 5.2
Week 10: 5.7 5.5
Week 11: 4.7 5.3
Week 12: 4.8 5.8

*Edit - apologies as the forum appears to have removed all my careful column formatting above as soon as I post, hope it's still readable!

So, for example, my last main meal above (week 12) was a Bolognese with 75 grams (dry) of whole wheat pasta and a side salad with a low fat mayonnaise, so I haven't been starving myself. For week 12 I was 4.8 mmol\l fasting in the morning and 5.8 mmol\l 2 hours post meal in the evening.

I thought I would put this out there and would welcome any comments at all. Will keep up the routine till I hit my target weight and then gradually relax while still testing weekly. Will probably wait another couple of months and get another A1c test.

Thanks all.

 

[Guilty]

Well done! And I'm jealous of those post-meal readings. What you're doing seems to be working great for you.

 

[muzungu]

Well done! And I'm jealous of those post-meal readings. What you're doing seems to be working great for you.

It's certainly an eye opener, for me anyway, how different things appear to work for different people. An excellent forum by the way, which has been an education for me.

As I say, I am not someone who relishes sitting around in a group so I haven't taken up the offer of the "Healthier You" program.
Not putting it down but it is just not for me. I find I am far more motivated and get more satisfaction when I do my own research and implement it; reading this forum has certainly been a major part of this.

 

[rexonaut]

It's certainly an eye opener, for me anyway, how different things appear to work for different people. An excellent forum by the way, which has been an education for me.

As I say, I am not someone who relishes sitting around in a group so I haven't taken up the offer of the "Healthier You" program.
Not putting it down but it is just not for me. I find I am far more motivated and get more satisfaction when I do my own research and implement it; reading this forum has certainly been a major part of this.

I got pre-diabetes diagnosis 2 years ago. Started with metformine. It reduced hikes, but did not solve the problem. My blood sugar started to rise from 6 at morning (one of the individual specifities).
Got a bit of panic and started to study and read. At first - bodies are different. I followed blood sugar after every meal and found out the main triggers. For me what and oats and any (even small piece) of cake. White wine is ok, Pilsner Urquel is ok, Belgium beers not. Rye bread is ok, bananas completely out.
At first I excluded from the diet “bad for me” food and started to drink mix of herbal teas (4 components plus cinnamon, curcum, ginger, lemon). I take also bitter lemon supplement.
At first I got sugar hikes down. But still happens once in 2 weeks. I got average down by 6 units, but still in pre-diabetes range.
Most importantly - I took Metformin at morning, and now I do not take it anymore.
I do not know how long it will be stable as I had some good weeks also before. But I feel the herbal tea helps. Plus avoiding my personal sugar boosters. It did not change my diet too much. I am trying to follow another rule: fiber first, then protein and then carbs. In restaurants not so easy. I discovered that many families on Balkans are doing it for generations.

I don’t count the carbs. Loosing few more kilos would be good, but it is not my main objective. And I like good food and wine as well. I had to stop eating goose liver - very big hikes.

 

[muzungu]

I have to admit being a bit of an obsessive when I put my mind to something, sometimes to my advantage sometimes otherwise.
Since my diagnosis I have not slipped once in my diet for nearly 3 months now; three meals a day at the same time at 6 hour intervals, all home made with nothing processed and just slightly smaller portions than normal. Whole wheat pasta, whole wheat bread, brown rice at almost normal portions and plenty of lean meats and vegetables. No alcohol, I don't drink anyway, and nothing with added sugar, not even a single biscuit! and nothing processed.

I am beginning to wonder whether my original A1C test was accurate as my latest instant spot test figures, last weekend, were 4.7 mmol\L fasting and 5.3 mmol\L 2 hours post meal, which are much the same as the previous 5 weeks' tests.
I am going to carry on till I hit my target weight which is about 21.5 on the BMI chart, this is roughly in the middle of the normal\green range. I will then get another A1C either privately or through the NHS to confirm everything. Seems I am just fortunate or lucky in how things are going, or I was never pre-diabetic in the first place!

 

[JoKalsbeek]

I have to admit being a bit of an obsessive when I put my mind to something, sometimes to my advantage sometimes otherwise.
Since my diagnosis I have not slipped once in my diet for nearly 3 months now; three meals a day at the same time at 6 hour intervals, all home made with nothing processed and just slightly smaller portions than normal. Whole wheat pasta, whole wheat bread, brown rice at almost normal portions and plenty of lean meats and vegetables. No alcohol, I don't drink anyway, and nothing with added sugar, not even a single biscuit! and nothing processed.

I am beginning to wonder whether my original A1C test was accurate as my latest instant spot test figures, last weekend, were 4.7 mmol\L fasting and 5.3 mmol\L 2 hours post meal, which are much the same as the previous 5 weeks' tests.
I am going to carry on till I hit my target weight which is about 21.5 on the BMI chart, this is roughly in the middle of the normal\green range. I will then get another A1C either privately or through the NHS to confirm everything. Seems I am just fortunate or lucky in how things are going, or I was never pre-diabetic in the first place!

You're doing an excellent job, and I totally hear you on the "not a group person" and "obsessive" being a perk sometimes...

Couple of notes: You might end up a bit malnourished on this. A carb is a carb is a carb, whether white or brown/whole grain. Your body'll have to process it eventually. So maybe look into things like courgetti (spiralised courgette) and such for pasta? Swede instead of spuds? Cauliflower rice? I'd never be able to get away with any kind of bread, really. But you're JUST over the diagnostic threshold, and I am quite thoroughly diabetic, so yeah.... What you're doing seems to be working, just try and let go of the idea that everything has to be lean. There are no carbs in fats, they won't influence your blood sugars, and if you cut down on carbs, something else will have to fuel your body. Protein and fats, as a matter of fact. So don't shy away from them. Don't go hungry, it makes any diet undoable in the long run. If you're not hungry, more power to you, but if you are... Full fat mayo'll go a longer way than the skinny stuff. (And, quite often if it's low fat, it's higher in carbs to give it flavor. Check the labels, as it's not always the case.)

All in all you're doing an excellent job, like I said. Just in case you're hungry though... Might be useful.
Keep it up,
Jo

 

[pinkjude]

The diabetic specialist nutritionist I saw said brown rice, brown pasta, good quality wholegrain bread preferably sourdough from a bakers not pre wrapped supermarket bread and potatoes cooked in skins eaten in small amounts will ultimately aid weight loss and even out BG levels. I dont eat pasta so spiralise courgettes but do occasionally eat 2 tbs brown rice with a home made curry.

 

[muzungu]

You're doing an excellent job, and I totally hear you on the "not a group person" and "obsessive" being a perk sometimes...

Couple of notes: You might end up a bit malnourished on this. A carb is a carb is a carb, whether white or brown/whole grain. Your body'll have to process it eventually. So maybe look into things like courgetti (spiralised courgette) and such for pasta? Swede instead of spuds? Cauliflower rice? I'd never be able to get away with any kind of bread, really. But you're JUST over the diagnostic threshold, and I am quite thoroughly diabetic, so yeah.... What you're doing seems to be working, just try and let go of the idea that everything has to be lean. There are no carbs in fats, they won't influence your blood sugars, and if you cut down on carbs, something else will have to fuel your body. Protein and fats, as a matter of fact. So don't shy away from them. Don't go hungry, it makes any diet undoable in the long run. If you're not hungry, more power to you, but if you are... Full fat mayo'll go a longer way than the skinny stuff. (And, quite often if it's low fat, it's higher in carbs to give it flavor. Check the labels, as it's not always the case.)

All in all you're doing an excellent job, like I said. Just in case you're hungry though... Might be useful.
Keep it up,
Jo

Thanks for that. Just read your linked blog post, excellent, given me some more ideas, extra dark chocolate and pork scratchings being among them! Already a cheese addict. It will be interesting for me to see how things pan out when I reach my target BMI (should be in a month or two) and gradually start to relax the diet so I no longer am losing weight, nearly there.

Thanks again,
Chris.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

The diabetic specialist nutritionist I saw said brown rice, brown pasta, good quality wholegrain bread preferably sourdough from a bakers not pre wrapped supermarket bread and potatoes cooked in skins eaten in small amounts will ultimately aid weight loss and even out BG levels. I dont eat pasta so spiralise courgettes but do occasionally eat 2 tbs brown rice with a home made curry.

Yeah.... My dietician said the same. Linked to the hospital. My endo said the same thing. Their "brown carb, low fat" diet blew my diabetes up like you wouldn't believe. I was over 105 kilo's and too ill to move most of the time. Not to mention a very painful liver that was killing me as well.

Thing is, you're going to hear a lot of contradictory information. I know I did, and I felt very confused, terrified, and absolutely abandoned: what I was told clearly didn't work. I was lucky enough to have a diabetic cat at the time, who was insulin dependent, so I got to borrow his blood sugar meter before I got my own. That told me exactly what carbs did to me (spike my bloodsugars into the twenties), what fats and protein did (nary a blip)... So, yeah. You've got a meter, now maybe start using it to check what your blood sugars do in response to foods? Test before a meal and 2 hours after the first bite. You're aiming for a rise of no more, and preferably less, than 2.0 mmol/l. Anything over that means your body couldn't cope with what you put in there. Mind you, you're just barely in the prediabetic range, so you might not be seeing a whole lot of difference there. BUT. And that's a really, seriously big but... If there's insulin resistance/diabetes, it can be progressive if diet isn't tackled. As you're still eating more carbs in a day than I would in a week, keep an eye on things. So, if your responses are all good when you check around meals, great, leave it be for a while.... But after half a year, or a year, start testing again and see whether things have stayed the same, improved or worsened. Keep on top of things, and trust your meter. It won't try to sell you on anything, it just tells you some facts you can act on. Or not.

You be good to yourself eh!
Jo

 

[Omar51]

Hello folks and just thought I would post my situation which in the great scheme of things is pretty insignificant in comparison to others, but anyway....
Following routine blood test, haven't had one for at least a decade, my GP tells me I have hit the lower pre diabetic A1c of 42 mmol\mol. Everything else fine.

I am 67, non drinker and non smoker and pretty active. This "diagnosis" was about 12 weeks ago now.

I haven't taken up the referral to the "Healthier you" program but after a bit of research feel much more motivated to do it all myself, I am not a "group" person. So upped the exercise routine and have been following a stricter diet for the last 12 weeks. Mainly smaller portions; meat, fish, fresh vegetables and still have carbs in the form of whole wheat bread and pasta, brown rice and such like. Nothing in the way of anything with added sugar and almost nothing processed. Actually quite enjoying it!

Anyway the results after 12 weeks.

Lost 7 kg so just over a stone and I am now firmly in the green zone on the BMI charts, and yes I know the shortcomings of BMI but it's an indication. 3 kilos yet to go to my target.
In the last 4 weeks I have been testing one day a week, fasting (11 hours morning test) and then in the evening post main meal. I have been using the Accu-Chek Instant system.

mmol\l - Fasting - Post meal (2 hours)
Week 9: 5.9 5.2
Week 10: 5.7 5.5
Week 11: 4.7 5.3
Week 12: 4.8 5.8

*Edit - apologies as the forum appears to have removed all my careful column formatting above as soon as I post, hope it's still readable!

So, for example, my last main meal above (week 12) was a Bolognese with 75 grams (dry) of whole wheat pasta and a side salad with a low fat mayonnaise, so I haven't been starving myself. For week 12 I was 4.8 mmol\l fasting in the morning and 5.8 mmol\l 2 hours post meal in the evening.

I thought I would put this out there and would welcome any comments at all. Will keep up the routine till I hit my target weight and then gradually relax while still testing weekly. Will probably wait another couple of months and get another A1c test.

Thanks all.

Indeed you are on the right track, good luck.

 

[muzungu]

May as well update this as the weeks go by, may be of interest, diagnosed "pre diabetic" A1c of 42 end of Feb:

Week 13:
Fasting 4.7 Post meal 5.3 (mmol\l)

This morning, week 14:
Fasting 4.8 (mmol\l)

 

[Outlier]

Impressive - well done!

 

[muzungu]

Just a quick update at Week 16, today's tests and averages - Accu-Chek instant:

mmol\l

Fasting: 5.1
Post meal: 6.1

7 days average: 5.7
14 days average: 5.6
30 days average: 5.6
90 days average: 5.5

Looks like I am top of things. Still 2kg to my target weight (22 BMI) and then slowly relax the diet to see how things go.

 

[Outlier]

Impressive - well done!

 

[KennyA]

Excellent stuff. Strictly speaking 42 is at the top end of the normal HbA1c range (38-42) but there is some error in the test and it could be a point or so either way. Do you know what your previous results were? There might have been an upward trend.

You can obviously tolerate a high amount of carb - you really want to keep it that way. It looks like removing "added sugar" items and processed food has been enough of an intervention. I could not eat what you're eating - pasta, bread, potatoes, rice - and return those figures.

 

[muzungu]

Excellent stuff. Strictly speaking 42 is at the top end of the normal HbA1c range (38-42) but there is some error in the test and it could be a point or so either way. Do you know what your previous results were? There might have been an upward trend.

You can obviously tolerate a high amount of carb - you really want to keep it that way. It looks like removing "added sugar" items and processed food has been enough of an intervention. I could not eat what you're eating - pasta, bread, potatoes, rice - and return those figures.

This was the first test I have ever had done, it wasn't specifically for HbA1c but covered everything; it was the only thing that stood out on the bloods, all else was normal.

I feel a bit of a fraud posting actually because in relation to others I really don't seem to have a problem. But anyway, I thought I would post just in case someone else who has hit 42 HbA1c gets some value from my posts. I will continue to update every now and again

 

[Resurgam]

The diabetic specialist nutritionist I saw said brown rice, brown pasta, good quality wholegrain bread preferably sourdough from a bakers not pre wrapped supermarket bread and potatoes cooked in skins eaten in small amounts will ultimately aid weight loss and even out BG levels. I dont eat pasta so spiralise courgettes but do occasionally eat 2 tbs brown rice with a home made curry.

I was told the same thing for decades. Never worked. Total nonsense as far as I was concerned. I repeated the same thing so many times and was always told I was doing it wrong. Every time. I believe it is called gaslighting.
Any grain or potato, or high starch vege sends my BG higher than I'd like it to be.

 

[KennyA]

This was the first test I have ever had done, it wasn't specifically for HbA1c but covered everything; it was the only thing that stood out on the bloods, all else was normal.

I feel a bit of a fraud posting actually because in relation to others I really don't seem to have a problem. But anyway, I thought I would post just in case someone else who has hit 42 HbA1c gets some value from my posts. I will continue to update every now and again

We are the same age. I discovered (on diagnosis) that I'd been having HbA1c tests done on me for at least ten years, routinely every August. Didn't know, and had no idea what they measured anyway. You probably have had the same, and it might be worth having a look back in your medical records. No-one had ever mentioned to me that I'd gone out of normal BG range probably somewhere around 2011.

The other reason I don't think you're over-reacting is that I had a range of nasty "high blood sugar" symptoms long before my BG was "officially" diabetic. I was (naturally) assured by my doctor that my numerous diabetes symptoms were not in fact symptoms of diabetes because my blood sugar wasn't high enough. I'm far from alone in this - in fact the level of 48 for diagnosis was chosen specifically because "diabetic retinopathy is rare beneath that level" - ie not unknown. I tend to think if you've got the symptoms, you've got the disease, but the health service is wedded to only diagnosing from the test.

 

[muzungu]

I should have been clearer that I haven't had a blood test ever previous to the one I had at the GP's in February, in fact I very rarely darken the doors of the surgery, perhaps a couple of times in the last decade.

It was only after I asked for a PSA blood test (my brother had just had surgery for prostate issues that prompted me to ask) that they decided to do a full blood test and this popped up. My PSA was actually quite low.

I did put on a bit of weight after retiring, which I have now lost, so although correlation is not always the same as causation, I was heavier than I have ever been and now back to where I was twenty years ago so it probably had some influence lesser or greater. I have to say I now feel better overall than I have for some time.

Curious that I have now been described as "skinny" when according to the BMI charts I am in the upper side of normal. If I went down to the bottom of the normal range I would be skeletal! I do realise the charts are only useful as an indication.

 

[muzungu]

Well, I fell off the wagon last night in a moment of weakness; I was feeling ill and exhausted, actually think I had some sort of bug as I am feeling much better today though not 100%. I bought myself a Lion bar duo and Mars bar duo after dinner. Interesting one off experiment on how this would affect by glucose if nothing else!

So two hours after consuming these delightful confections my glucose was 5.9 mmol\l and this morning fasting was 5.2 mmol\l so this appeared to have almost no effect in comparison to my readings over the last 3 months.

Back on the wagon now with a vengeance as feeling guilty. Another 4 weeks and hope to get to my target weight; just 2 kilos to go.