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New T2 morbidly obese and scared

Discussion in 'Newly Diagnosed' started by JennyFrog, Jan 15, 2020.

  1. JennyFrog

    JennyFrog Type 2 · Member

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    I was diagnosed with T2 last week. I have been morbidly obese my whole life (currently nearly 21 stone). I feel like I have a very good understanding of carbs/starch/sugar and nutrition in general. I have tried many diets and eating plans in the past.
    They are never successful because I can’t keep them up.

    I started on metformin and insulin and I’ve been eating really well and my fasting blood sugars have dropped to almost normal. But I am so scared that I can’t keep this up because I have never managed to before for more than a couple of months. I feel ashamed and guilty and I get cross when it is implied that I just need education. I am so low.
     
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  2. xfieldok

    xfieldok Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to the forum.

    When I started out I had a couple of stone to lose, but my main concern was my very high hba1c.

    I decided to go keto, less carbs than lchf. It took around 4 weeks to break the carb addiction then I lost my hunger, had to be reminded to eat. The weight dropped away without my thinking about it.

    I know what effect carbs have on my blood glucose. I feel that this way of eating is sustainable in the long term. There are lots of lovely things to eat. At first it does take planning, but it becomes second nature.

    Stop with the shame and guilt. You have found the right place for help and support.

    Read around the forum and as questions.

    Someone will be along shortly with interesting links which I can't post on my phone.
     
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  3. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Master

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    Hi Jenny and welcome.

    We have almost all been there.. newly diagnosed (I had an HbA1c of 87 mmol/m and weighed 23 stone).
    Like you I'd tried many diets in the past as well and wasted thousands on gym memberships with little to no lasting success.

    The joy of finding a low carb diet that didn't leave you hungry at any time but also harnessed your hormones to help rather than hinder was a revelation. Many here have found it works for them too.

    http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/basic-information-for-newly-diagnosed-diabetics.26870/

    Have a read around the forum and please ask anything that you find confusing... hopefully you will find this place as life changing as many of us have.
     
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  4. Juicyj

    Juicyj Type 1 · Moderator
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    Hello @JennyFrog and welcome to the forum :)

    Well done for being brave and writing this, it takes courage to face up to our circumstances and you are already doing so well, so be proud of yourself in already achieving normal fasting blood glucose numbers. It's very much a marathon though not a race, so getting yourself into the mindset of adjustments that are required to help you live a healthier life are important. Please don't feel ashamed or guilty though, you're already giving yourself a telling off which isn't necessary, you wouldn't talk to your best friend like this so don't do it to yourself, be proud, you've found a site here which can help support you on your journey. I would be keen to see how you progress so please keep us posted :)
     
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  5. Bildad

    Bildad Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Hi and welcome @JennyFrog as has already been said most of us have been where you are now to some extent or other. Last March I was shocked when I went for my annual blood test and it had risen to 78. I have been type 2 for about 10 years. I was then 6 stone overweight. I also have been obese most of my adult life. Since going low carb / keto I have lost my sweet tooth and my carb cravings. No one was more carb addicted than I was. My diet consisted of carbs and very little else. Mainly biscuits chocolate chips and more chocolate. It took about 3 weeks of total carb abstinance but the cravings passed and I haven't looked back. I have tried most other diets and lost a bit relapsed and put more back on.
    So far I have lost just over 4 stone lowered my Hba1c to 35 lost 10 inches off my waist all of that without much exercise except walking the dogs.
    My advice would be to give low carb a go you really haven't got much to lose and a whole load to gain.
     
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  6. JoKalsbeek

    JoKalsbeek Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Ah, you just need some education! (Sorry, couldn't resist). You, and just about 80% or so of GP's, diabetes nurses and dieticians, because the bulk of them have absolutely no idea about relatively recent research and break-throughs in T2 management. So if the people who actually get paid to know all this stuff have no clue whatsoever, how are we, the patients, supposed to know?

    You mention you have a pretty good grasp of carbs/nutrition, but what goes for healthy people doesn't always count when it comes to people with a metabolic disorder, like we have. So when you say you changed your diet etc, we kind of do need specifics, to see if there's anything we can actually help with or if everything we can tell you is old news. Heaven knows a lot of people come in here saying they're cutting fats and going for all brown carbs and loads of fruit... And they have no idea why their blood sugars are going drastically up, rather than down. So... Can we start from scratch? What does your diet look like now, (You know, an average day's food and drink) and do you test your heart out? Because if you are on insulin and hitting a low carb diet, then I see hypo's in your immediate future. (It's a tight rope, so be careful and keep jelly babies handy! But hopefully you'll be off the insulin soon...) Also, you mention trouble keeping up diets. As you probably know, carbs are addictive, so any time you have some you'll crave more of them later. Three months or so in you shouldn't still experience cravings, so I wonder where things kept going wrong with the other diets. Social situations maybe? (Christmas, birthdays, Easter etc). Feeling left out or anything else you can pinpoint as problematic? If you can identify problematic hurdles beforehand, you can brace yourself or find a different solution. (At birthdays there's usually a selection of nuts and cheeses I can eat. I don't miss the birthday cake. And honestly, to me it now tastes so sickly sweet, I wouldn't enjoy it anyway).There's work-arounds for just about anything, just takes a little looking-for and maybe asking others how they handle things.

    I am thinking with the diets you've tried this may be old news, but here's a little quick-start guide for low carbing. https://josekalsbeek.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-nutritional-thingy.html Also.... Before, the diets were just that: diets. Not something that's supposed to save your life and quality of said life. The stakes are higher now, than they were before. Who knows, realising that might help as well?

    Give a shout if there's anything we can help you with!!!
    Jo
     
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  7. Lotties

    Lotties Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Totally. Never thought I'd be full enough to skip meals on such a regular basis as I really wasn't hungry and more importantly knew I wasn't going to be hungry until the meal after. That's LCHF for you if you eat enough fat!
    Welcome.
     
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  8. mouseee

    mouseee · Well-Known Member

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    I thought I knew sensible diet stuff, but I didn't know I was insulin resistant and therefore carbs were my biggest enemy in any form!

    As you're on insulin you need to be very careful if you go low carb though as low carb and insulin can lead to hypos. Lots of people have good experience in this so ask plenty of questions.

    The key to sticking to it is consider the choice... I'd rather give up eating pasta and and rice (of whatever colour) than say goodbye to my eyesight or limbs. It's not always easy, but I figure it's easier than the alternative!

    This forum is great for motivation so stick around!!
     
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  9. Honeyend

    Honeyend · Well-Known Member

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    My daughter is severely overweight, she once lost 5 stone but by not eating proper food,so put it all back on.
    The thing is about a low carb higher fat diet, is you can eat food you can enjoy, like bacon, egg and mushrooms,but just leave off the fillers, the rice, potatoe,chips, bread and pasta. Its not a diet, stopping you from eating, its a way of eating.If you want an extra slice of bacon, have it.
    Some people cut out almost all the carbs, keto, but that can take a real attension to detail, I am too slap dash. I work in blocks of 10 carbs, if the portion size is under 10, I will give it a go, and eat about 50-80 a day. To put that in to context a slice of white bread can be roughly 13-18 carbs.
    Its easy to feel over whelmed, this did not happan over night so it will take a while for things to change, but they will change and you will feel better. |There is a big net on here to catch you.
     
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  10. JennyFrog

    JennyFrog Type 2 · Member

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    Thanks. I have done Keto diets, Atkins, weight watchers, slimming world, low carb, low fat, paleo, calorie counting, Noom, just about everything. I lose a couple of stone and then pile it back on - and more - because i find it is not sustainable. I lose motivation, I get depressed then I feed my face with sugar and takeaways. Sorry to be rude but you are still assuming I don’t know how it works chemically. I haven’t read anything in the last week about diet and nutrition that I didn’t already know.

    my issue is anticipating my failure in maintaining a suitable diet. Because that has been my downfall since I was a child.
     
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  11. xfieldok

    xfieldok Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    You are not being rude. We don't know you and you don't know us. We have many people who come to the forum who think they are eating low carb. When we get a typical days menu, they are not.

    Did you actually get into ketosis? Most of us find that when we achieve this, we lose interest in food. Provided you have a few recipes in your repetoire that are really tasty (and easy), your golden. Bare with us!
     
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  12. JennyFrog

    JennyFrog Type 2 · Member

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    Yes been in ketosis before. I missed fruit and very quickly got sick of meat, eggs and fish. In the end I couldn’t look at them. This week I’ve eaten a ton of veg and just stopped eating bread/refined sugar/fruit juice/crisps/general ****. I am still eating whole fruit and other carbohydrates and this suits me and I know I will lose weight this way. I had GD years ago and I know this works for my sugars too. Just the thought of doing it forever is so ****** miserable. My eyesight is already wrecked and I know it’s a case of tough, suck it up or lose a foot etc but it feels so bleak and impossible to maintain.

    Post edited by moderator for language
     
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    #12 JennyFrog, Jan 15, 2020 at 9:47 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 15, 2020
  13. Mike D

    Mike D Type 2 · Expert

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    There's few barriers you can't overcome. Attitude is the hardest
     
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  14. EllieM

    EllieM Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Remember that weight gain is a symptom of T2 diabetes, so chances are that if you've been eating a diet with too many carbs for your particular metabolism, it's that that has caused the obesity, rather than some failing of character or will power of yourself. You can't help your genetics, and unfortunately for the last few decades the fashion in the food industry has been to replace fat by carbs, leading to modern diets that are far too high in carbs for many people to cope with.

    T2s normally produce excess insulin because their bodies can't process carbs properly - excess insulin plus high blood sugars lead to weight gain and a poorer metabolism - a vicious circle that can last for years (decades?) before the metabolic disorder progresses to a full fledged T2 diagnosis. You're now adding more insulin to the mix, which isn't great but at least is bringing your blood sugar down. Honestly, any reduction in carbs is likely to help at this point, though as others have said you may need to watch out for hypos if you reduce your carbs, as you'll probably need to reduce your insulin as well. (I'm not the right person to comment on this, because as a T1 I produce no insulin at all, so insulin has to be matched fairly accurately to food intake, and I'm not exactly sure what the rules are for T2s who are supplementing their own insulin production.)

    Sugar is very addictive, so it's not surprising that in the past you've lapsed - think of people who've tried and failed to give up smoking. And many/most of us on these boards, whether T1 or T2 (or other forms of diabetes), have times when they lapse and eat things they maybe shouldn't. As you're on insulin you'll have a blood testing meter and you'll be able to see what happens if you fall off the wagon (there are loads of folk on here who post about this and they get support to get back on again.)

    So I understand your fears and your guilt but I really urge you to try to work through the fears and set aside the guilt. You're not responsible for the genetics that mean a typical modern diet will lead you to weight gain and T2 diabetes, but you can work to mitigate those genetics. Please don't give up. Many of the T2s posting on these boards have been in your position and achieved normal blood sugars in the long term.

    Maybe you do or don't need education, but it sounds to me that you do need moral support. That's also freely available on these forums.

    Good luck.
     
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  15. Resurgam

    Resurgam Type 2 (in remission!) · Expert

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    I understand how important weightloss can seem - but are you checking how your blood glucose is reacting to the fruit and vege?
    I find no difficulty in eating low carb veges, berries, salads, nuts, full fat yoghurt as well as protein and fat and make varied meals - I used to have two shopping lists which I used alternately, even now I rarely buy tomatoes and mushrooms in the same shopping trip, so as to push me into making different meals. I make desserts with sugar free jellies, gelatin, yoghurt, cream, berries, grated high cocoa chocolate, I cook various waffles based on egg and cheese, I buy low carb bread, either livlife or protein bread with only 4 gm of carbs a slice, and I have bought various things mail order to make low carb options.
    These days, after three years, I find some things are overly sweetened for my adjusted taste. I also find that I need very little to eat. I usually eat twice a day - but just realized that I did not eat dinner today, having intended to eat when I came back from morris practice, I just forgot.
    I wonder if you became sickened by the allowable foods because you were eating too much - low carb foods are highly nutritious, and I have been eating just the two meals a day for a long time - now it seems I don't even need that. I'd better go and tidy away the food in the kitchen so I can have it tomorrow.
     
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  16. Indy51

    Indy51 Type 2 · Expert

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  17. JoKalsbeek

    JoKalsbeek Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Not rude at all, you'd be surprised though how often people say they know what they're doing and then... Don't. So we tend to double-check. It's a concern-thing, not a "you can't possibly know what you're on about" thing. Also, it's not about losing weight. Weight loss is more of a happy side effect while you're getting blood sugars down via low carbing. And less visceral fat usually means better insulin sensitivity. (So if you do lose weight, be careful not to overshoot insulin... Your needs may change as your body changes).

    I've fallen off the wagon a bunch of times. Because of grief, because of stress, because my husband came home with heaps of chocolate around Christmas... I just get back on after a day, or a week, and continue the diet I was on. I don't throw my hands in the air and go, "Well, I knew I was going to f*** this up, so forget it". I KNOW I will screw up here and there. Kind of comes with being human. But being doomed to failure doesn't mean I can't try again. I haven't had pus leaking from my toes for years anymore, no more thrush, less pain, less fatigue, infections and inflammation, less eye trouble, so it's been worth it, and toppling off the wagon didn't change that, those were just blips.... Oh, and about eyes: With better control of your blood sugars, be it with insulin injections, medication or diet, there's less sugar distorting your vision. Your brain's been compensating for it all this time, so it needs a few weeks to get used to the new normal. So if things are worse, vision wise, right at this moment, that's actually a good sign. Provided the eye-check doesn't come up with retinopathy. (And even that can improve as your blood sugars do). But if it's a sugar-eyeball-brain thing, don't go to Specsavers just yet, just get some 2 quid reading glasses to get you through those few weeks.

    One last thing: Diet isn't for everyone. Is it better in the long run? Yeah. Less chances of the D escalating, less chance of complications, than with medication-only, less side effects, and for me personally, less depression to boot... But it isn't for everyone. You do have a choice here. You could try cutting some carbs and getting meds as support in the background, you can do meds-only, you can do diet-only.... No-one's putting a gun to your head and forcing you to do it this way, or that way... It's your body, your health, and you have a say in all this. A lot of people here go the diet route and are perfectly happy with that. Others tumble into a deep depression because due to other issues there's little food options left to them, or food was a big part of their joie de vivre, or... There's lots of reasons one may not want to go the diet-only route. You're not supposed to be a prisoner of a diet you hate. It's impossible to keep up if you don't enjoy what's on your plate. I have a couple of conditions that have food triggers. That means there's a bunch of keto foods I can't touch without suffering for it. (And I do mean suffer; rheumatism, IBS and migraines are no fun) But there's still enough left for me, like eggs, veggies, poultry, meat, fish, goat's cheeses etc, that I don't feel I'm missing out on anything, and what I do eat, I love. That works for me. Might not work for someone else though, and I don't expect it to.

    You do you. There's nothing rude about choosing what is best for you, whatever you decide that is.
    Jo
     
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  18. VashtiB

    VashtiB Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hello and welcome,

    I agree with the previous posters- many many of us have been where you are. I went very low carb as soon as I was diagnosed- less than 6 months later I have lost about 18 kg. The very first time in my life I have lost weight without counting calories and doing copious amounts of exercise.

    What people are saying is true for me- having gone very low carb I am so so much less hungry than every before. I am not going to lie and say it is all easy- there is a lot to learn but you will learn it. I still miss carbs but they are increasingly easy to resist and not to pine after.

    Anyway- people are here to support you whatever you decide to do. This place is so helpful and supportive

    Good luck, welcome and let us know how we can help and feel free to vent.
     
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  19. HSSS

    HSSS Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    You’ve had loads of great advice and support above. It sounds like getting your head around it is the biggest obstacle. Is that accurate? You are focusing on the negative, That you will fail, that the food is boring etc etc.

    There are myriads of websites and recipes out there to give variety to low carb. Is it the same as “normal” food? No. Can it be varied and interesting? Yes, but you will have to be willing to take the time to experiment and try new foods so that it doesn’t turn into a boring plain meat veg and eggs every day. I’d go mad (and do - when I can’t be ***** to make something different meal after meal).

    Focus on what you can eat, not what you can’t. Surely 85% choc, bacon and double cream make up for some of the sugar?

    Try and identify what goes wrong on previous diets? are you bored? Are there still enough carbs in it that the cravings are maintained? Are you hungry? Do you feel weird in company? Do you resent having to eat different? Did it truly cater for your body’s needs? (you’ll have had metabolic issues in the build up to type 2, possibly for years or decades). And has been said getting the bloods under control will almost certainly accidentally lead to weight loss despite many being told it’s the other way round.

    Try it for a few weeks and see what happens as there’s nothing to lose but glucose and lbs. but do watch levels closely for hypos and treat accordingly. If you are regularly hitting lower numbers then insulin will need adjustment downwards til hopefully you’re off of it entirely. Test before your meal and importantly 2 hrs after and see what happens? More than a 2mmol rise means even with the insulin there’s too many carbs for your body to deal with.
     
  20. JennyFrog

    JennyFrog Type 2 · Member

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    HSSS yes thanks for hearing me.
    what goes wrong is the perfect question. Probably defeatism, impatience, depression, wanting to eat socially (I sound like a smoker, probably similar addiction).

    bacon and double cream hold no joy for me. It’s always been about the very worst (savoury) carbs available. I think that I am completely addicted to food and have used it to cheer myself up for years. If it’s going to kill me then what do I cheer myself up with now? Yay your kidneys didn’t fail today!

    The rise after meals is interesting. I’ve had exactly the same lunch for 4 days this week (measured, pre-made) and the change in blood sugar has been different each time. (Down 1, stayed the same, up 2). Obviously still getting used to not shoving rubbish in my pie hole. But got my first target reading today before lunch (7.8). And my insulin went down to 8 units yesterday. So as I keep saying, I am happy with how to eat right. I just have a deathly fear of failing to adhere to it.
    .
     
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