P:E dieting

lucylocket61 said:

Is it possible to do this if you have to eat little red meat?

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Definitely. Fish, chicken, cheese, Greek yoghurt all have a lot of protein, as do eggs. Harder to get it from plant based sources, but not impossible. Think @Krystyna23040 would be better placed to advise than me as I’m heavily red meat based.

lucylocket61 said:

I weigh around 200lbs, so how much protein do I need?

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Bit of a matter of opinion. This is a decent guide: https://www.dietdoctor.com/food-policy/protein and based on the weight you gave, a rule of thumb would be anywhere between 109g and 180g a day.

Goonergal said:

Large portions of meat/fish. In my one meal yesterday, which consisted solely of lamb shoulder, I estimate there was about 140g protein in the meal. Didn’t weigh it, so that’s based on the size of the joint, minus a bit for the bones.

Today after a couple of self-made burgers, topped with an egg and 3 rashers streaky bacon, followed by Fage 0%, I reckon I’m already at 65g. That’s not including any incidental protein in the (very) small portion of onions with the burger, 7 or 8 raspberries and a small amount of Hunter + Gather mayo.

Should add that while I definitely prioritise protein, I am no longer looking at leaner cuts as I get better results with the fattier cuts, so per 100g my protein content is likely slightly lower than someone eating leaner cuts. But my portions are not small!

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Thanks @Goonergal. I can happily eat fish - well salmon and sashimi, lamb shoulder if I have to but not on their own

ianpspurs said:

Thanks @Goonergal. As I type this I know I couldn't do that for love nor money. I can happily eat fish - well salmon and sashimi, lamb shoulder if I have to but on their own? Will never happen unless something in me radically changes. I simply cannot comprehend how anyone can do that - massive respect. I really do appreciate you taking the trouble though.

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Split into more than one meal, there’d be room for other ‘stuff’ on the plate or on a different plate. Green things do sometimes make an appearance on mine

Krystyna23040 said:

Just a quick update. I am so pleased with how things are going. Although I am not quite achieving the 1g of protein per lb of bodyweight my protein intake is more than double what it was prior to the PE diet and this seems to be working well for me.

When I started in April I had to keep my carbs very strictly below 20g to achieve good blood sugars. Now I am so pleased to report that 30g of carbs now gives me really good blood sugars. I am sure that this is because I am building lean muscle mass.

it is so wonderful to be able to have a bit more yoghurt or kefir or a few more berries or even tomatoes or occasionally some onion - without messing up my blood sugars.

If course there have been a lot more benefits to prioritising protein - like the increase in energy and feeling so well - but having a little bit more flexibility with the carbs has made me really happy.

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Phenomenal, your journey is a superb template for how to find your level. What if you just dogmatically stuck at 20 g? It is likely a combination of things you are doing, like a multiple revenue stream company. Love this.

Goonergal said:

Split into more than one meal, there’d be room for other ‘stuff’ on the plate or on a different plate. Green things do sometimes make an appearance on mine

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Thanks. This is absolutely N=1. I have read lots by Naiman and intellectually I nod happily. I just can't physically do it. Some kind of mental block I guess. I can happily eat cold - previously cooked, obviously- meat as a snack. Meat or fish on their own is a step too far.

lucylocket61 said:

This is interesting. I don't know how I missed this thread.

Is it possible to do this if you have to eat little red meat?

I weigh around 200lbs, so how much protein do I need?

Thanks

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@lucylocket61 I don't eat very much red meat at all but as @Goonergal posted - eggs, cheese, fish, chicken and Greek yoghurt all do have plenty of protein.

Like @ianpspurs I just cannot eat a plate full of protein so do supplement with about 30g of whey, pumpkin seed, chia seed or rice protein powders a day.

Mbaker said:

Phenomenal, your journey is a superb template for how to find your level. What if you just dogmatically stuck at 20 g? It is likely a combination of things you are doing, like a multiple revenue stream company. Love this.

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Yes, l agree that it is a combination of things I am doing and I will still definitely do 20g days as it has been a vital component of going into 'remission ' but it is so lovely to be able to do 30g days also.

Well, I have worked out that I am only eating around 50g of protein a day. Is that bad?

lucylocket61 said:

Well, I have worked out that I am only eating around 50g of protein a day. Is that bad?

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@lucylocket61 I was eating between 40g and 50g of protein a day but am so much better on double that, or even up to 130g a day when I have a very active day. Have definitely built lean muscle mass on higher protein levels.

I cannot state that tomorrow the P:E diet will begin, but I certainly this relationship will be considered in my 60-day challenge period which will begin tomorrow (jan, 17, 2022).

I will consider three basic guidelines:

1. To keep my anxiety under control
2. To keep under caloric deficit
3. To keep a K/AK above 1.5(*) or a P:E above 1.1

Theese items are presented hierachically, i.e., 1 is more important than 2 and 2 is more important than 3

Guideline 3 will operate in the following manner: depending on my anxiety, my psycological hungry, I will keep the K/AK compliant, otherwise I will be P:E compliant, because P:E gives me more satiety.

(*) For the ones who are unfamiliar with the K/AK factor:
it can be accepted as a ketogenic meal some event which is compliant with the following formula:
K/AK = (0.8*F + 0.46*P) / (1.0*C + 0.1*F + 0.58*P)
P: protein; F: total fats; and C: carbohydrate
To keep a ketogenic meal we need to keep a K/AK ratio greater than 1.50
This formula is cited on [1, p. 52] from [2]
Compared to the 4:1 original concept of the ketogenic diet, this formula is easier to be followed.

[1] Lyle Mcdonald. The Ketogenic Diet: a complete guide for the dieter and practicioner. Austin: e-book, 1998.
[2] Withrow CD. The ketogenic diet: mechanism of anticonvulsant action. Adv Neurol
(1980) 7: 635-642