Prediabetic may now be just "diabetic"

[Grumpy1954]

HI all, I'm 69 and in UK (Shropshire) and am disabled with poor mobility, very high bp and other problems.. Wife has been type 2 for years..
Last blood test the GP told me I was just over the line , wants repeat bloods in 3 weeks to confirm. Even then he doesn't want to put me on metformin like my wife, as I also have age related kidney function problems (also on last bloods)
For the time being, I sleep reasonable, feel rested when I wake, but as soon as I start moving around I feel tired again, and lately need a short afternoon nap most days (an hour to 1 1/2hrs)
My wife had me check my blood sugars the last 2 mornings, yesterday was 8.5, today 10.1 which she says probably is diabetes. I usually have some porridge or toast when I get up, and a mug of black coffee. Anyone have any comments or (helpful) suggestions? Thanks

 

[Antje77]

Hi @Grumpy1954 , welcome to the forum.

I usually have some porridge or toast when I get up, and a mug of black coffee. Anyone have any comments or (helpful) suggestions? Thanks

All carbs turn to sugar in your bloodstream, and porridge is high carb.

feel rested when I wake, but as soon as I start moving around I feel tired again, and lately need a short afternoon nap most days (an hour to 1 1/2hrs)

Tiredness nd feeling the urge to nap can be caused by high blood glucose (it definitely did for me), so if this happens after breakfast and lunch it might be related to your food choices.
You might like to have a go at bacon and eggs or full fat Greek yoghurt for breakfast and see if you'll feel better than after your porridge.

My first suggestion would be to have a read of this informative piece on T2 and nutrition, written by one of our members. https://josekalsbeek.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-nutritional-thingy.html

My second suggestion is to use that meter to test before and after foods to see how you react to different meals.

Good luck!

 

[HSSS]

Ditch the porridge and toast and have some eggs. Bacon too if you eat meat. Have the repeat GP test and see what it says.

In the meantime check what your levels are when you feel sleepy and consider what the preceding food and drink have been. Think about breads, potatoes, cereals, oats, pastry, flour, fruit juice etc as well as sugar. Try the next time with less of these and more meats, dairy, cheese eggs, veg and salads etc. Use a fork if it means the food isn’t wrapped in those things on the list. (Ie. Bowl or plate of the important ingredients rather than a carb laden “wrapper”) See if that makes a difference to sleepiness and levels.

 

[jjraak]

Our bodies , huh.

Higher carbs when we're T2D, make for spikes, which damage us if it's sustained.
And lows can means tiredness, and increase hunger.

If the tiredness ties in to a higher carb meal, do as @Antje77 suggests and follow the two hour test protocol with your wife's meter.

You might find out how surprising your blood rise is.

If it is, you have learned something and can likely make changes to your diet & health.

Good luck with the 2nd test being on a more positive note.

 

[Grumpy1954]

Thanks every one - I did do the 2 hr tests today, at my wife's suggestion. I went from 10.1 before eating to 8.4 later. New to me, I thought 10.1 meant too much sugar, but first thing in the morning, that doesn't make sense. oh, the GP said my last bloods showed Hb10c of 48.
We'd been having porridge as we'd been told over the years under Healthy Eating to have wholemeal everything, bread, pasta etc and porridge as a slow energy release food. Wasn't sure if the tiredness was just old age, stress or waiting for the landlord to sort a rotted radiator in lounge, with the seals gone on the back door it make it very cold - supposedly being fixed on 22nd, though we'll still have some damp and mould problems, we have a dehunidifier drying the carpet out in that room, unfortunately we spend a lot of time in.

 

[Antje77]

Thanks every one - I did do the 2 hr tests today, at my wife's suggestion. I went from 10.1 before eating to 8.4 later. New to me, I thought 10.1 meant too much sugar, but first thing in the morning, that doesn't make sense.

In the morning people often see their highest number because the liver dumps glucose in the bloodstream to help you going for the day. It's called Dawn Phenomenon.
The morning number is the only one you can't do much about, but your numbers after food you can.

What food did you test going from 10.1 to 8.4?

We'd been having porridge as we'd been told over the years under Healthy Eating to have wholemeal everything, bread, pasta etc and porridge as a slow energy release food.

Wholemeal carbs are a bit slower than white carbs, yes. But they still increase blood glucose. It makes more sense to reduce the carbs altogether to me.

 

[jjraak]

I did do the 2 hr tests today, at my wife's suggestion. I went from 10.1 before eating to 8.4 later.

Hi @Grumpy1954 .

Just for clarity.

One of the things that can help when T2D, is to try to make our fasting time a little longer

While we sleep, we clearly 'Fast', hence breaking our Fast, became BreakFast

So the 8 hours sleep... we fast,
Many stop eating early in previous evening say. 7pm....adding 3 hours to that Fast, if bedtime & sleep is 10pm to 6am.

Then some aim for 16-8 split.
8 being the 8 hour window they eat in, 16 being the hours of Fasting , a split frequently noted to give the best outcomes

Your post reads to me, like you got up, tested your blood sugars (these would be your Fasting Blood Glucose aka FBG levels.)

Then you ate, and 2 hours later tested and got 8.4.

If so, then your score is mixing up the BOOST the Dawn Phenomenon with your post meal test.

A better test would be to wait upto 3 hours after waking, IF you can.

Then test your BG.
Eat something
Then 2 hours after you BEGAN eating test your BG levels

That would give a clearer picture of your ability to cope or not with the level of carbs at that meal.

Bear in mind, while the HBA1c does suggest you are T2D, though at 48 at the lowest level to qualify for our T2D club, your overall symptoms might still be related to one of your other complaints or even something new.

The test above is all part of what many T2D's do, play detective & find out as much as we can about how we react to carbs AND Ways to limit & reduce any inability to process carbs that we now have.

If you can manage to eat later after you wake up, that would be useful..if not simply test the later meal/s in the same way.

Good luck .

 

[aylalake]

I had very high blood pressure and this frequently made me tired and sleepy. I don’t know if perhaps this could also be adding to possible high blood glucose.

I reduced my blood pressure from >150/>95 to <125/75 by switching to a low carb way of eating and it has made a huge difference to my energy levels.

Our bodies are unique to ourselves, so what works for one may not work for another. Experiment and see what works for you.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

HI all, I'm 69 and in UK (Shropshire) and am disabled with poor mobility, very high bp and other problems.. Wife has been type 2 for years..
Last blood test the GP told me I was just over the line , wants repeat bloods in 3 weeks to confirm. Even then he doesn't want to put me on metformin like my wife, as I also have age related kidney function problems (also on last bloods)
For the time being, I sleep reasonable, feel rested when I wake, but as soon as I start moving around I feel tired again, and lately need a short afternoon nap most days (an hour to 1 1/2hrs)
My wife had me check my blood sugars the last 2 mornings, yesterday was 8.5, today 10.1 which she says probably is diabetes. I usually have some porridge or toast when I get up, and a mug of black coffee. Anyone have any comments or (helpful) suggestions? Thanks

One other thing to consider.... We're all talking about going low carb, which often means no more bread, cereals, potatoes, corn, rice, pasta etc.... All those things contain salt. So usually, when someone starts low carbing to drop their blood glucose, their salt-intake drops too. And with it, elevated blood pressure can get lower or even normalise. (And should you be on blood pressure medication, you might even go too low, and need to reduce medication when you start seeing stars or things go black when you stand up). Also, both high blood pressure and high blood glucose can damage kidneys. Low carbing can in potential, be the magic bullet for you. Up to you though, but thought you should know. Like sugar, salt is a cheap taste enhancer, so there's a lot of either or both in (over-) processed foods. Cut the bulk of those out and you might find a number of things changing.

I had surprisingly normal blood pressure when diagnosed, but went a tad lower (not too low, thankfully), my cholesterol is fine, my non-alcoholic fatty liver disease that was supposed to kill me some 6 years or so ago went the way of the dinosaur, while my blood sugars normalised. I did lose weight, but regained some when hormones decided to start looking into this whole menopause thing, and I did some comfort-eating when my mom passed. Never got back to being morbidly obese and extremely ill and fatigued though, and blood sugars still happy. Nothing I expected going in, but joyous side effects of getting my blood sugars under control through diet.

As for wholemeal, yeah... That'd be an excellent healthy choice for my husband. His metabolism works as it should, he can deal with it. I have Metabolic Syndrome (diabetes type 2 falls under that umbrella), so wholemeal or white carbs are still carbs I'll need to process, which my body just isn't good at. Different strokes for different folks, really. Convenient thing: you and your wife both deal with (pre?)diabetes, so.... I have to admit, it is easier to adhere to a new diet when you do it together. I cook as I normally would, just have more meat/fish and above ground veg, and just make potatoes or pasta for my husband, which I for the most part, don't touch. A fry has been known to vanish sometimes, but that's about it. Amounts matter, so I can get away with a little. Not a whole portion though. Not even half or a quarter of one. My meter told me so, and that, as you'll find is a rather crucial tool. So while we're all "come on, jump on our bandwagon!", it may be something to discuss with your partner first. How happy is she with her blood sugar control, are the complications or side effects she wants to be rid of? Doing it together may be worth considering. And if not, then not; there's lots of ways to deal with diabetes, but it just so happens that low carbing might help in a few other areas of concern as well.

Good luck, and welcome to the forum!
Jo

 

[Grumpy1954]

In the morning people often see their highest number because the liver dumps glucose in the bloodstream to help you going for the day. It's called Dawn Phenomenon.
The morning number is the only one you can't do much about, but your numbers after food you can.

What food did you test going from 10.1 to 8.4?

Wholemeal carbs are a bit slower than white carbs, yes. But they still increase blood glucose. It makes more sense to reduce the carbs altogether to me.

It was porridge, just plain made with half water half milk. Guess I'm going to have to get used to all this now, thankfully you all seem very friendly and helpful on here.

 

[Grumpy1954]

I had very high blood pressure and this frequently made me tired and sleepy. I don’t know if perhaps this could also be adding to possible high blood glucose.

I reduced my blood pressure from >150/>95 to <125/75 by switching to a low carb way of eating and it has made a huge difference to my energy levels.

Our bodies are unique to ourselves, so what works for one may not work for another. Experiment and see what works for you.

 

[Grumpy1954]

MY BP is medicated down, it all started years back when I had 6 months of stupidity with DWP and the local Council and the stress sent my BP to 200/175. It did reach those levels again recently, and I've had some sort of itchy rash on my legs, with retained water meaning I had no visible knees or ankles. In hand now, GP had me on 3 blood tests, an ecg, 2 x rays and some others I forget. Could well be the stress from all thatr as well, my usual stress relief is to go for a motorcycle ride, but with my ankles still swollen I can't get my boots on.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

MY BP is medicated down, it all started years back when I had 6 months of stupidity with DWP and the local Council and the stress sent my BP to 200/175. It did reach those levels again recently, and I've had some sort of itchy rash on my legs, with retained water meaning I had no visible knees or ankles. In hand now, GP had me on 3 blood tests, an ecg, 2 x rays and some others I forget. Could well be the stress from all thatr as well, my usual stress relief is to go for a motorcycle ride, but with my ankles still swollen I can't get my boots on.

Normally I'd ask to see people's cats, but that bike sounds interesting...!

Another thing: carbs retain water. Reduce carb intake, and the first weight you lose, is called water-weight, because you pee for England and might even become a bit dehydrated. (Which means getting headaches and sore muscles/joints for a bit, as well as fatigue. Electrolyte supplements should help until your body gets used to the difference, which should take up to 2 weeks). The rash could be diabetes related as we tend to get yeast infections all over the place when blood sugars are high, but it could be a water-retention thing too, dunno which.

Anyway... I can keep talking about the low carb perks until the cows come home, which I don't know might be irritating to you by now. So you could shut me up by telling me a little about that bike? I know nothing about them, just love the look of them (and, granted, the sound of a Harley), and had my first and only morotcycle accident in utero. Mom thought my dad wasn't going to make the rather tight corner, so she let herself fall off the back of the bike, and rolled into the grass beside the road. Last summer I finally got my husband to take me to a Harley day over in the town of Woerden. (He was reluctant because I can be a little reckless). No colours allowed, but all sorts were there, and there I was, bouncing around with my camera's in a flowery dress, haha. Could not have been more out of place, but I loved it.

So, yeah.... Better get dinner started. Hope you're okay, and we've probably given you a lot to mull over... Any questions, throw them out there.
Jo

 

[KennyA]

MY BP is medicated down, it all started years back when I had 6 months of stupidity with DWP and the local Council and the stress sent my BP to 200/175. It did reach those levels again recently, and I've had some sort of itchy rash on my legs, with retained water meaning I had no visible knees or ankles. In hand now, GP had me on 3 blood tests, an ecg, 2 x rays and some others I forget. Could well be the stress from all thatr as well, my usual stress relief is to go for a motorcycle ride, but with my ankles still swollen I can't get my boots on.

Hi

You know we can't and won't diagnose on here, so I'm going to tell you a bit of my story instead.

From 2010 until mid 2020 I had severe water retention in my lower legs and feet particularly. At first I thought my feet had started growing again. The water swelling also appeared in my hands and fingers, eyelids, everywhere. My kidneys were very reluctant to produce any urine and for most of the time between 2011 and 2020 I was on various diuretics, at steadily increasing levels. They didn't really work. This led to lymph-filled blisters (technical term is bullae) forming and fluid starting to leak directly through my skin.

Around 2014/15 I developed red legs - lower legs became very red and inflamed and itchy, with "shin spots" - a problem because my skin was like tissue paper. Scratching didn't end well.

These are all classic T2 diabetic symptoms - my practice didn't recognise them as diabetic symptoms and treated each in isolation.

They all went, very quickly, in the first six months of 2020 when I got my blood glucose to normal levels. And they've not been back since.

Although I can't say for sure, it sounds like what you're describing is close to what I experienced. You'd need to get the opinion of your medical team. If they are in fact diabetic symptoms, they may well improve or vanish with blood glucose reduction.

 

[Grumpy1954]

Normally I'd ask to see people's cats, but that bike sounds interesting...!

Another thing: carbs retain water. Reduce carb intake, and the first weight you lose, is called water-weight, because you pee for England and might even become a bit dehydrated. (Which means getting headaches and sore muscles/joints for a bit, as well as fatigue. Electrolyte supplements should help until your body gets used to the difference, which should take up to 2 weeks). The rash could be diabetes related as we tend to get yeast infections all over the place when blood sugars are high, but it could be a water-retention thing too, dunno which.

Anyway... I can keep talking about the low carb perks until the cows come home, which I don't know might be irritating to you by now. So you could shut me up by telling me a little about that bike? I know nothing about them, just love the look of them (and, granted, the sound of a Harley), and had my first and only morotcycle accident in utero. Mom thought my dad wasn't going to make the rather tight corner, so she let herself fall off the back of the bike, and rolled into the grass beside the road. Last summer I finally got my husband to take me to a Harley day over in the town of Woerden. (He was reluctant because I can be a little reckless). No colours allowed, but all sorts were there, and there I was, bouncing around with my camera's in a flowery dress, haha. Could not have been more out of place, but I loved it.

So, yeah.... Better get dinner started. Hope you're okay, and we've probably given you a lot to mull over... Any questions, throw them out there.
Jo

Lol, no worries about the low carbs etc stuff, all new and interesting so far. hadn't thought about the water bit or the rash, which I keep telling the GP started itchy overnight on my buttock cheeks, assumed I'd just got too hot under the quilt, getting it sometimes on my hands. As for peeing for England, already doing that, they've got me on 3 water pills a day for the water retention. BY chance, my wife's first boyfriend didn't have a full bike licence, "borrowed" his dad's 600cc Honda to take her out, didn't tell her to lean on bends, so the first one saw them through a hedge into a farmer's field. Both my current bikes are Honda's, a 700cc Deauville, and as I'm getting older, a lighter 500cc Rebel. I started on a Bsa bantam, 175cc at 16 (dad's influence) then due to shortage of British bikes in the 70's, went to 250 twin Honda then an early one of the now legendary CB750-4's. Rebel should be on my profile pic, will try to add more. OK, can't only load Deaux went with Rebel and my first "back to bikes" 600cc Hornet from 2018

 

[Grumpy1954]

Hi

You know we can't and won't diagnose on here, so I'm going to tell you a bit of my story instead.

From 2010 until mid 2020 I had severe water retention in my lower legs and feet particularly. At first I thought my feet had started growing again. The water swelling also appeared in my hands and fingers, eyelids, everywhere. My kidneys were very reluctant to produce any urine and for most of the time between 2011 and 2020 I was on various diuretics, at steadily increasing levels. They didn't really work. This led to lymph-filled blisters (t term is bullae) forming and fluid starting to leak directly through my skin.

Around 2014/15 I developed red legs - lower legs became very red and inflamed and itchy, with "shin spots" - a problem because my skin was like tissue paper. Scratching didn't end well.

These are all classic T2 diabetic symptoms - my practice didn't recognise them as diabetic symptoms and treated each in isolation.

They all went, very quickly, in the first six months of 2020 when I got my blood glucose to normal levels. And they've not been back since.

Although I can't say for sure, it sounds like what you're describing is close to what I experienced. You'd need to get the opinion of your medical team. If they are in fact diabetic symptoms, they may well improve or vanish with blood glucose reduction.

I didn't know about the diagnosis bit, but I do now. Very interesting story, as I'd had all that, including the lymph-filled blisters. GP prescribed 2 creams, one with as steroid content to address the redness and itching, and another to moisturise the skin, plus a high dose of diuretics. The GP I'm seeing is my normal one, and not the Practice Diabetic specialist. I'll certainly bring it up next week when I'm back in again.

 

[jjraak]

my usual stress relief is to go for a motorcycle ride

I hear that, my friend.

Only bikers really know why dogs put their heads out car windows.

 

[jjraak]

started itchy overnight on my buttock cheeks

I Get that too.

Usually my BG running high.

 

[Antje77]

Only bikers really know why dogs put their heads out car windows.

Not a biker but I do know!
When I was a child, my father had a 2CV, and I was sometimes allowed to stand up on the back seat with my head out of the open roof, felt amazing.
The little white dog on my shoulder in my profile pic is too small to stick her head out of the window, so she climbs onto my shoulders to do it, window opened far enough for her head but not her body.

Rebel should be on my profile pic

Love the pic, hopefully you can swap your shoes for boots again shortly and enjoy your rides again!

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Lol, no worries about the low carbs etc stuff, all new and interesting so far. hadn't thought about the water bit or the rash, which I keep telling the GP started itchy overnight on my buttock cheeks, assumed I'd just got too hot under the quilt, getting it sometimes on my hands. As for peeing for England, already doing that, they've got me on 3 water pills a day for the water retention. BY chance, my wife's first boyfriend didn't have a full bike licence, "borrowed" his dad's 600cc Honda to take her out, didn't tell her to lean on bends, so the first one saw them through a hedge into a farmer's field. Both my current bikes are Honda's, a 700cc Deauville, and as I'm getting older, a lighter 500cc Rebel. I started on a Bsa bantam, 175cc at 16 (dad's influence) then due to shortage of British bikes in the 70's, went to 250 twin Honda then an early one of the now legendary CB750-4's. Rebel should be on my profile pic, will try to add more. OK, can't only load Deaux went with Rebel and my first "back to bikes" 600cc Hornet from 2018

You have lovely wheels, and excellent taste! I do hope the boots'll fit again soon... It seems like a fine way to blow off steam. I don't see the bikes you mention/shared here and on my profile in the Netherlands often... Seems like everyone's either on a Harley, usually vintage/classic and/or special paint, which has me rubbernecking from the car's passenger seat, or a lime green Kawasaki Ninja. (Did they give those away with cereal or something? Nothing wrong with them, there's just so many...! I like a little variation and individuality!). Goldwings seem to all migrate to the south the moment the weather picks up and touring becomes attractive.

Aaaanyway, sorry to derail the thread. But I do enjoy a good pic of a bike, haha.
Have an excellent weekend, and I do hope that by now you know you have options and you have room for improvement, in quality and quantity of life.
Jo