Type 2 diabetic (kind of)

[Andydragon]

Thank you all for your replies and feedback I'm definitely going to look into that website for meal ideas!

- are there any go to snacks or meals I should have in my arsonary?
- anything I should definitely avoid?
- what are good and ideal readings?
And what is too high and too low?
- I have the contour next one tester, is there one I should specifically get or look out for?
- should I be getting a tester and strips through my gp?
- would it be a good idea to eats carbs and test to see how what affects me and what doesn't?
My nan eats tonnes of carbs and she's t2 and fine

I'll definitely stick to this forum as seems to be a lot more help than anywhere else! Especially how I know the diabetes website is wrong

And I'm keeping a food diary!

Thank you all for your support again! Its nice to soeak to real people that know the disease!

Some people can tolerate more carbs than others. Others use medication to control their blood levels and continue to eat the bad stuff. This is a bad thing, it leads to the need generally to take increasing medication and eventually insulin, so I don’t know if your nan is in that position? Also depends what is fine, she has okay hba1c?

doctors will most likely not prescribe blood testing kit, they are supposed to for certain drugs but don’t always.

food diary is good. I paid for scales and try and weigh everything now. I Have an app to track and update calories/carbs/etc. I know some on here would recommend just doing carbs and ignore calories, but Intend to overthink it. It’s really eye opening how many carbs are in things though

 

[Humminglime]

I dont really know what hba1c is
She's on insulin now so maybe that's why?

I dont want to get into weighing my food as i feel that for me it'll bring back a bad relationship with food and I'll obsess over it and how little I can get it to.

I try not to eat out too often but I do like going for a meal. Outside of that i make my own meals, take packed lunch to work etc.

That's a shame, if it's so important it should be gp prescribed in my opinion.

I'll give it a go at testing what affects me!

 

[Brunneria]

Hi @Humminglime and welcome

Great advice above, so I won't go on about food, since lowering carbs is likely to help you a lot.
No need to go hungry though - just eat more meat, fish, eggs, cheese and veggies to compensate and make sure you are full.

One think I did want to mention though - you were identified as preD last September and then had a gall bladder op and infection over Xmas.

I have known i was pre diabetic since September last year or so. I then had my gallbladder out over Christmas and ended up with a huge infection, took over 2 months to heal from the key hole surgery and narrowly missed a 2nd one.

The gall bladder is right next to the pancreas, and a massive infection may (please note that I am stressing the word may) have had a bit of a knock on effect on the pancreas. It is the pancreas that releases insulin. This could be long or short term (or not happening at all), but I would encourage you to get it checked out.

So while you may have been heading towards T2 before that op, it is possible that the op and the subsequent infection kicked it up a gear.

My suggestion would be to do two things:

Firstly enquire at reception at your surgery for online access to your medical records. That way you will be able to see the actual results of the tests they have run. You may have to jump through a few hoops, such as producing ID and signing the application forms, but it only has to happen once, and then you can check your own results in future. Getting results like that is FAR better than getting vague misinformation from your nurse!

Secondly, I would insist on a referral. Say that you have been left in the dark and don't feel confident that you are being given the best treatment. They may push you towards another doc, but you can ask for a referral to the nearest diabetes clinic. The best place to get your pancreas investigated would be the diabetes (endocrinology) clinic, since they will have had plenty of experience with patients for whom reduced pancreatic function leads to diabetes. That type of diabetes even has a name 'Type 3c'. And while it is very unlikely that you have it, it would still be a good idea to have it eliminated as a possibility, by a healthcare professional.

Please keep posting, and let us know how you get on?

 

[Humminglime]

Thank you so much for recommending the dietdoctor app, I could cry there are so many recipes on there!

 

[ziggy_w]

Thank you all for your replies and feedback I'm definitely going to look into that website for meal ideas!

- are there any go to snacks or meals I should have in my arsonary?
- anything I should definitely avoid?
- what are good and ideal readings?
And what is too high and too low?
- I have the contour next one tester, is there one I should specifically get or look out for?
- should I be getting a tester and strips through my gp?
- would it be a good idea to eats carbs and test to see how what affects me and what doesn't?
My nan eats tonnes of carbs and she's t2 and fine

I'll definitely stick to this forum as seems to be a lot more help than anywhere else! Especially how I know the diabetes website is wrong

And I'm keeping a food diary!

Thank you all for your support again! Its nice to soeak to real people that know the disease!

Hi @Humminglime,

Lots of good and important questions.

Personally, if i am out and about for a longer period of time, I usually take some snacks with me. These include nuts (pecans, almonds, brazils, walnuts and hazelnuts), babybel cheeses and high-cocoa-content chocolate (I use 88%, but it might be better to work your way up maybe from 70%).

For breakfast, eggs in any which form is a good goto option, maybe accompanied by bacon. I often have scrambled eggs with spring onions and cheese or sometimes roasted eggplant.

Foods that most of us avoid are high sugar or high starch foods such as cereal and grains, bread, pasta, potatoes, rice and tropical fruits.

Ideal readings are probably between 4 mmol and 8 mmol, slightly higher or lower than this shouldn't be a problem. As you are not on any medication, you shouldn't have to worry about going too low.

The Contour Next One is an excellent meter (and one of the most precise), but strips can be a bit pricey. There are cheaper options out there,@Rachox has some great advice on those.

You can always try to get a prescription for strips -- sometimes GPS will prescribe them for a couple of months for newly diagnosed T2s to help get glucose levels under control. Keeping my fingers crossed for you.

Personally, I have never tried and tested obviously high carb foods, just those on the borderline such as legumes -- which seem to be fine for me unless in huge quantities. However, this having been said, it is a very individual decision and may depend a bit on how important continuing to have these higher carb foods as part of diet is for you.

 

[Humminglime]

Hi @Humminglime and welcome

Great advice above, so I won't go on about food, since lowering carbs is likely to help you a lot.
No need to go hungry though - just eat more meat, fish, eggs, cheese and veggies to compensate and make sure you are full.

One think I did want to mention though - you were identified as preD last September and then had a gall bladder op and infection over Xmas.



The gall bladder is right next to the pancreas, and a massive infection may (please note that I am stressing the word may) have had a bit of a knock on effect on the pancreas. It is the pancreas that releases insulin. This could be long or short term (or not happening at all), but I would encourage you to get it checked out.

So while you may have been heading towards T2 before that op, it is possible that the op and the subsequent infection kicked it up a gear.

My suggestion would be to do two things:

Firstly enquire at reception at your surgery for online access to your medical records. That way you will be able to see the actual results of the tests they have run. You may have to jump through a few hoops, such as producing ID and signing the application forms, but it only has to happen once, and then you can check your own results in future. Getting results like that is FAR better than getting vague misinformation from your nurse!

Secondly, I would insist on a referral. Say that you have been left in the dark and don't feel confident that you are being given the best treatment. They may push you towards another doc, but you can ask for a referral to the nearest diabetes clinic. The best place to get your pancreas investigated would be the diabetes (endocrinology) clinic, since they will have had plenty of experience with patients for whom reduced pancreatic function leads to diabetes. That type of diabetes even has a name 'Type 3c'. And while it is very unlikely that you have it, it would still be a good idea to have it eliminated as a possibility, by a healthcare professional.

Please keep posting, and let us know how you get on?

Thanks for your reply! I was told by the diabetes optician that it is likely the op and the huge I section pushed me into diabetes, something to do with infections increase blood sugar levels?
He said he confident thst would be the cause as i was pre diabetic before.
Would you believe it took 7 years on frequent visit to the gp to get them to diagnose my pain and then get them to remove my gallballader. One doctor told me it was period pain in my rib cage!!! I was livid!
I think I can gain access online as when I first joined that skirted around the edge of it but nothing further.

I'm going to try and make an appointment and get referred as I'm getting no where with them I understand everything I difficult during covid but I need some help at least..
I'll definitely keep posting on here I've gotten more info in 12 hours than 9 months! Thanks again

 

[mike@work]

Sorry @ziggy_w . I deleted my post, mostly because it was not very well thought out. Had some assumptions there, that I had to self-censor...

 

[ziggy_w]

Thank you so much for recommending the dietdoctor app, I could cry there are so many recipes on there!

Hi @Humminglime,

Other good low-carb sites include "All day I dream about food" and " I breathe I'm hungry".

 

[Rachox]

Thanks for the tag @ziggy_w

Here’s some info on UK meters, and to be clear I have no commercial connections with any of the companies mentioned.

Spirit Healthcare have a meter with cheap strips, the Tee2 + found here:

http://spirit-healthcare.co.uk/product/tee2-plus-blood-glucose-meter/

with the strips found here:

http://spirit-healthcare.co.uk/product/tee2-testing-strips/

Some members have got a free Tee2+ by phoning up to order, with a large order of strips they often throw the meter in for free:

Phone number 0800 8815423


With more expensive strips is their Caresens Dual which I currently use, this one has the advantage of glucose and ketone testing in one machine, it’s to be found here:

https://shop.spirit-health.co.uk/collections/caresens-dual




Home Health have recently bought out this one, but I haven’t heard any reviews yet, links to strips and the meter:

https://homehealth-uk.com/all-produ...ose-meter-test-strips-choose-mmol-l-or-mg-dl/


There are also discount codes for when you come to buy more strips - "navii5" and "navii10" will give you 20% off purchases of 5 packs of strips and 25% off 10 packs of strips respectively (these are printed on a business card supplied with the meter).


And to be totally transparent I used to use the SD Code Free from Home Health which has the cheapest strips available if bought in quantities of 5 or 10 pots with the codes below. However I found it to be becoming less and less reliable. Here it is for anyone wanting to give it a go, just bear in mind it seems they are replacing it with the Navii, details above.

https://homehealth-uk.com/all-products/codefree-blood-glucose-monitoring-system-mmoll-or-mgdl/


and here for the extra strips

http://homehealth-uk.com/all-products/sd-codefree-test-strips-to-be-used-only-with-the-sd-monitor/

There are discount codes if you buy in bulk.

5 packs 264086

10 packs 975833


Disclaimer, I haven’t used any of the discount codes I have quoted so I don’t know if they are still current.


Don’t forget to check the box if you have pre diabetes or diabetes so you can buy VAT free. (for all meters and strips)

 

[HSSS]

Would you believe it took 7 years on frequent visit to the gp to get them to diagnose my pain and then get them to remove my gallballader. One doctor told me it was period pain in my rib cage!!!

Yep. Took me about 4 yrs numerous gp visits and couple of ambulance runs the pain was so bad. Eventually I worked it out and asked a locum is it gallbladder and he said yes probably let’s get a scan..... Most outlandish suggestion from A&E I got was a torn rotator cuff. No idea how that would cause a similar pain

 

[HSSS]

@Humminglime I’m not so sure you have been doing keto if you are eating the things you listed as there’s way too many carbs there still for keto, or was that previously?

How many carbs each type 2 can tolerate varies, a lot. This is what a meter tells you, alongside the hb1ac. So definitely get hold of your figures from the drs. Never accept arbitrary summaries again. Always get the name of the test, the numbers and the units the numbers are counted in and the “normal” range for that test so you can do your own research if you choose. Online access or a printout should give you all of this in one place.

What one gp might called “doing ok” depends very much on their expectations for their patients. Hb1ac (the 3 month average blood test) will tell you far more than a comment. The fact your gran is on insulin suggests that maybe she hasn’t managed so well and the carbs she eats are why she’s on it. Not definite as she may no longer produce a great deal of insulin but probably she did once and eating fewer carbs might have prevented or delayed the pancreas ‘running dry’ as it were.

8’s are way better than 16’s so be pleased not frustrated. It’ll improve still.

 

[MrsA2]

@Humminglime I'd also add it is worth totally forgetting about calories and calorie deficits. It will mean a major rethink but calories have no place in diabetes, or not when first getting under control. Eating protein and low carb until you are full, then stopping until the next meal is best and you won't be hungry.
I've been doing this six months now, used snacks of nuts or olives or plain yoghurt in first few weeks, now dont need them. I've lost about 3 stone and rarely felt hungry. It is so very different from all other diets, but it works, and is for life, so don't rush, panic or stress. There's a lot to learn and you may have a few odd effects as your body adjusts and you come off the sugar/carb addiction but stick with it. You will feel so much better, and slimmer

 

[ianf0ster]

.....
- are there any go to snacks or meals I should have in my arsonary?
- anything I should definitely avoid?
- what are good and ideal readings?
And what is too high and too low?

If you can avoid it then it is best to avoid snack and just have 2 or 3 meals per day. But For now, don't starve yourself because lots of people including me have lost weight on a Low Carb High(e) (traditional) Fat way of eating - not a diet! For now, don't count Calories, just cut carbs!

The more times per day you eat even just a few carbs, the more times your Insulin will rise. Insulin is the 'Fat Storage Hormone' . It helps you store energy as body fat and it stops you from 'burning' up your existing body fat. So if you want to lose weight you need to try and keep the Insulin in your blood stream low for as long (number of hours per day) as possible!

Things I eat when I know I really shouldn't be eating are all low/no carbs - so they are safe unless I really overdo it!
Nuts, hard cheses like cheddar, cold meat (chicken or ham slices etc.), olives, hard boiled eggs, celery sticks (some others can eat raw carrot sticks without spiking their Blood Sugar but I can't).

Don't worry about 'ideal' Blood Glucose readings yet! Just work towards getting fairly good ones. Between 4.0 and 8.0 is the 'good range'. This means that since you have been used to quite high Blood Glucose numbers, you would probably feel unwell if yours went below 4.0 mmol for a year or so. Also you want to try to keep it no higher than 8.0 if you can. That means 8.0 2hrs after taking the first bite of a meal! For a meal to be OK for you to eat again, the Meter reading 2hrs after first bite shouldn't be more than 2.0 mmol higher than the pre-meal reading.
Some meals actually reduce Blood glucose readings in the morning. For example when I started LCHF I used to eat 2 boiled eggs for breakfast (no bread/toast), or some cheddar cheese. Whenever my early morning Blood Glucose reading was high the zero carb breakfast would reduce it! For example pre-breakfast 7.8 or 8.0 then post breakfast reading of under 7.0

Our Liver thinks we still live in the stone age and so when we wake up it puts lost of glucose into our blood so that we have the energy to go and hunt or gather our breakfast. Eating some no carb calories convinces it that we will be OK without the extra glucose.

- I have the contour next one tester, is there one I should specifically get or look out for?
- should I be getting a tester and strips through my gp?
- would it be a good idea to eats carbs and test to see how what affects me and what doesn't?

I'm not familiar with that BG meter, I got a basic one with the cheapest test strips because I was told I would use a lot of test strips for the first couple of months because I would be testing before and after every meal. So mine ( a Spirit Tee2) doesn't connect to my phone, but it can (after enough readings) estimate my HbA1C.

You can try to get test strips on prescription - but the vast majority of us are told 'it's not necessary' or even 'it is harmful to test'. So we have to buy our test strips ourselves - which is why i went for the meter with strips only costing around £8 for 50 instead of a meter where they cost £25 or more for 50.

Unless you adopt a 'carnivore way of eating (like a cat or a dog) its just about impossible to avoid carbs completely. So there is no need to go searching to test them. Just test before and after your meals and check what the highest carb foods were in those meals. You will soon learn which ones to avoid or to cut down the portions of.
We are all different in our tolerance of cat=rbs. Some of us can eat the odd small boiled potato, or find that porridge is OK. But for me, I can't eat more than 1/2 a tomato, or an apple, or even a raw carrot!

My nan eats tonnes of carbs and she's t2 and fine

How do you know your nan is OK eating tonnes of carbs? What is her HbA1C? Was she ever told about carbs rather than just sugar? Was she told that carbs and natural sugar like in honey and fruit and starch in potatoes is just as bad as table sugar?
And how much medication does she need for her diabetes? Most Type 2's who eat lots of carbs eventually need to inject Insulin several times per day - and the doses gradually increase.

Good Luck, this has been beaten by many and even without even the mildest T2D medication (metformin).

 

[Humminglime]

@Humminglime I’m not so sure you have been doing keto if you are eating the things you listed as there’s way too many carbs there still for keto, or was that previously?

How many carbs each type 2 can tolerate varies, a lot. This is what a meter tells you, alongside the hb1ac. So definitely get hold of your figures from the drs. Never accept arbitrary summaries again. Always get the name of the test, the numbers and the units the numbers are counted in and the “normal” range for that test so you can do your own research if you choose. Online access or a printout should give you all of this in one place.

What one gp might called “doing ok” depends very much on their expectations for their patients. Hb1ac (the 3 month average blood test) will tell you far more than a comment. The fact your gran is on insulin suggests that maybe she hasn’t managed so well and the carbs she eats are why she’s on it. Not definite as she may no longer produce a great deal of insulin but probably she did once and eating fewer carbs might have prevented or delayed the pancreas ‘running dry’ as it were.

8’s are way better than 16’s so be pleased not frustrated. It’ll improve still.

I did keto before properly, I did it 5 days on 2 off kind of Rota!
I lost half a stone in 2 weeks it was crazy but then I had my op and couldn't move for a month and couldn't stomach much food!

I've looked into getting y2k result buts to get them online I have to register which I have to go into the practice for. Which i can't do unless i make an appointment but they at sonly taking phone appointments so I'll ring tomorrow and see what can be done! If anything!

 

[Humminglime]

I’m trying to avoid snacking as much as possible but wasn’t sure what I could and couldn’t eat to tie me over if I’m hungry after a meal! I work weird shifts so sometimes I can’t eat at the correct meals times and end up hungry. I’ll give protein as a snack a go I do love pepperami. Unfortunately eggs give me horrendous acid reflux so they’re off the table unless they’re in things
I do however LOVE cheese!

I’m hoping changing my diet will help me lose this extra couple stone I don’t need and howfully have a positive impact ton the diabetes too!

Ive been trying to stick to below 8 but so far I’ve had nothing below 7!
I don’t really get a lot of unwell feeling symptoms when my sugar is too high, so when I was 16.9 I felt absolutely fine and that worried me more than anything because surely I should have felt unwell?
When is high too high? When do I have to go to a doctor?

I think I’ll change metres, mine is 100 strips for £25.. and I’m questioning it’s reliability!

Luckily I love meat and have started to enjoy fish so I don’t mind upping the amount of meat I eat

You provided me with lots of new info thank you! I’m starting to feel much less overwhelmed and maybe I can actually get this disease under control!

I had no idea pricking my thumb would be so painful!! Or that after I had tested if my finger get cold they hurt more now!

Oh no, might go isn’t likely to prescribe them to me then! God forbid they put a prescription out for something you really need not sure how you’re supposed to manage your sugar levels if you don’t know what they are to start with..

I was hoping I could eat porridge because love it!

To be fair my Nan is insulin dependant so she probably increases her does so she can eat carbs but she like the tradition meat, veg and potato meals!

 

[Humminglime]

@Humminglime I'd also add it is worth totally forgetting about calories and calorie deficits. It will mean a major rethink but calories have no place in diabetes, or not when first getting under control. Eating protein and low carb until you are full, then stopping until the next meal is best and you won't be hungry.
I've been doing this six months now, used snacks of nuts or olives or plain yoghurt in first few weeks, now dont need them. I've lost about 3 stone and rarely felt hungry. It is so very different from all other diets, but it works, and is for life, so don't rush, panic or stress. There's a lot to learn and you may have a few odd effects as your body adjusts and you come off the sugar/carb addiction but stick with it. You will feel so much better, and slimmer

That’s a good way to think about it, I’ve never liked counting calories makes me feel like I have a bad relationship with food and I get a little obsessive at how little I can’t get them to so I don’t want to weigh food or count it. Carbs I guess is different!

I don’t like Greek yogurt on it’s on so I’ve been adding a little honey but I’ve been told that’s really bad for us too I’ll have to look for another alternative!

 

[HSSS]

I did keto before properly, I did it 5 days on 2 off kind of Rota!
I lost half a stone in 2 weeks it was crazy but then I had my op and couldn't move for a month and couldn't stomach much food!

I've looked into getting y2k result buts to get them online I have to register which I have to go into the practice for. Which i can't do unless i make an appointment but they at sonly taking phone appointments so I'll ring tomorrow and see what can be done! If anything!

Perhaps they can post the forms or make an appointment for admin as opposed to a dr?

 

[HSSS]

I had no idea pricking my thumb would be so painful!! Or that after I had tested if my finger get cold they hurt more now!

I never use my thumbs. In the first few weeks I managed to get one very sore and swollen and it put me off them. It also got me to educate myself how to test for least pain.
Being well hydrated really makes a difference. Warm hands are really helpful, only prick at the edges, never the middle of the fingerprint or on the top tip. If you’re a slow bleeder massage finger from palm to tip a few times before pricking, then wait a moment before activating your strip so blood is ready and you aren’t panicking and squeezing the tip (not recommended for pain after or quality of sample). Use a different finger or part of the finger each time and have a scheme to rotate it so you don’t stab the sam done all the time. If you have a particularly tricky one you have enough to skip it.

 

[MrsA2]

for me, its middle, ring and little fingers only, on the side and after washing in warm water

 

[Humminglime]

There are so many dessert options on this dietdoctor app! It's given me a lot of hope for what we can eat! I've found waffles and pancakes!! Cake!! I didn't realise there was so much we could eat it's just finding the alternative ingredients! All hope is not lost!