WW or Slimming world

[teddybear74]

hi all

just got back from a review and nurse has suggested keep carbs down and lose some weight. I was thinking of joining one of the groups mentioned in the title but not sure which way to go. my last hba1c beginning of this year was 103 im on 12u and 16u of insulatard and 5u of novo rapid at meal times has anyone had success with either of these please

 

[JoKalsbeek]

hi all

just got back from a review and nurse has suggested keep carbs down and lose some weight. I was thinking of joining one of the groups mentioned in the title but not sure which way to go. my last hba1c beginning of this year was 103 im on 12u and 16u of insulatard and 5u of novo rapid at meal times has anyone had success with either of these please

Neither. Sorry. They're not geared to deal with people who have a metabolic disorder, so they're both too carb heavy. https://josekalsbeek.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-nutritional-thingy.html <-- this is a low carb infosheet I wrote, but there's more information in Dr. Jason Fung's The Diabetes Code... My sheet's free, Fung's youtube video's are too... Just keep in mind that if you go low carb, your blood sugars are going to drop like a stone. (And you'll face-plant with it), so do adjust your insulin accordingly eh... Test often and keep hypo treatment at hand as long as you're on insulin.

 

[xfieldok]

Insulin won't help you lose weight.

Is there any reason why you can't ditch the carbs?

 

[HSSS]

Neither. Or huge caution with both. Neither work on a low carb basis and routinely advocate high carb, low calorie, ”filling” options .

People do have success on there, for a while. Repeat customers are their business

 

[teddybear74]

so why do they both say they ae suitable for diabetics. my nurse said insulin will make me put a little weight on and as im only 10.13 im still classed as over weight. I want to lose a couple to half a stone anyway. I was diagnosed 6 years ago type 2 and was given steroid last year and I haven't been able to get them back under control since I have lost a lot of weight already but wrongly as my sugars have been running so high im on more medication now than I have ever been on and its increasing

 

[xfieldok]

Just take it from us, their not. Neither is qualified to advise diabetics on diet.

Please look into lchf and keto. If you don't have a meter, you need one.

 

[teddybear74]

ok I have a meter im just putting ideas out there. nurse did mention about a course DAFNE but she doesn't know if it is suitable for type 2s

 

[xfieldok]

DAFNE probably because you are on insulin. Atr you counting carbs for your novorapid?

 

[teddybear74]

nope as I have only been on novorapid a few weeks

 

[Rokaab]

ok I have a meter im just putting ideas out there. nurse did mention about a course DAFNE but she doesn't know if it is suitable for type 2s

Generally I thought the DAFNE courses were restricted to Type1's but I may be wrong (the local variant of it that I went on was T1's only)

 

[JoKalsbeek]

so why do they both say they ae suitable for diabetics. my nurse said insulin will make me put a little weight on and as im only 10.13 im still classed as over weight. I want to lose a couple to half a stone anyway. I was diagnosed 6 years ago type 2 and was given steroid last year and I haven't been able to get them back under control since I have lost a lot of weight already but wrongly as my sugars have been running so high im on more medication now than I have ever been on and its increasing

There's a candy shop in the Netherlands that goes to all sorts of markets. Their candy is advertised as suitable for diabetics in big, loud lettering. What it is, you ask? A lump of hardened HONEY with herbs. Anyone cay say it's suitable for diabetics, often going from the old guidelines, or just assuming it is... These days we know better, but they'll still tell you it's all good. I followed the dietician's advice, which wasn't far off from WW actually, which I'd tried a decade or so before, as a teen when it didn't do anything for me either because of the PCOS and resulting insulin resistance... Anyway, the last time I followed a low fat, high carb diet, prescribed by the hospital, it got me from obese to morbidly obese and diabetic. It's the carbs we can't handle, and it's the carbs they so love to shove down throats...

You're on a lot of medication. Steroids will also up blood sugars (as would statins by the way), so that's another issue... Why are you on them? Low maintenance dose or higher ones? All in all it's not the weight you should be concerned about right now, but getting your blood sugars under control. Weight loss will follow automatically from there. Get the blood sugars back in line and you'll be able to quit a lot of what you're on, I'm sure. (with your doc's approval, of course!)

 

[teddybear74]

im not on steroids anymore they wont give them to me unless I desperately need them to control my asthma

 

[JoKalsbeek]

im not on steroids anymore they wont give them to me unless I desperately need them to control my asthma

That's alright then... It'd be a bit problematic if you were on them every day in relatively high doses. Just keep in mind they do up your blood sugars even for a while after you stopped using them, but they should come down a bit later. Also, carbs are inflammatory. Now that I think about it, I've barely needed the ventolin since I started eating this way. Could be a coincidence, but my reumatism is practically non-existant now too and that i do know is due to the keto. So who knows. Could be an added benefit for you too.

 

[xfieldok]

Novorapid is generally 1 unit per 10g of carbs. It also takes around 15 minutes or so to take effect, so you need to take it before you eat.

 

[teddybear74]

don't I know it I was hospitalised for 3 days for it on a sliding scale insulin and god knows what else felt like a guinea pig with all the tests a room on my own I felt like I was in isolation no one could answer why

 

[teddybear74]

Novorapid is generally 1 unit per 10g of carbs. It also takes around 15 minutes or so to take effect, so you need to take it before you eat.

ok thanks I have been on 4units in the evening but going up to 5 units morning and evening at mo she is going to check with matron at hospital and im seeing her in 2 weeks time

 

[HSSS]

so why do they both say they ae suitable for diabetics. my nurse said insulin will make me put a little weight on and as im only 10.13 im still classed as over weight. I want to lose a couple to half a stone anyway. I was diagnosed 6 years ago type 2 and was given steroid last year and I haven't been able to get them back under control since I have lost a lot of weight already but wrongly as my sugars have been running so high im on more medication now than I have ever been on and its increasing

Because til very recently diabetes was seen as a progressive disease that was only ever going to get worse and medication was the only thing to do to even slow it down. NOT TRUE
Because sadly the powers that be have exclusively, til recently, told everyone that diabetics can eat the same as everyone else. That it’s all about calories and fat. NOT TRUE

if fundamentally we can’t cope with carbs because we are resistant to insulin the best thing we can do is not have too many carbs and reduce the insulin resistance. Large amounts of insulin in the blood that struggles to function actually increases resistance long term even if short term it clears the blood of glucose.

 

[mouseee]

It was a mixture of WW and SW that got me here! (Along with lots of other factors!)
Years ago I lost a stone on WW. Put it back on. SW lost 1 1/2 stone in 18 months. Put it on and more, although that was over the next 3 years.
Low Carb has lost me 2 stone in 6 months. And put my hba1c into 'normal' range in about the same time.

I have got two ladies at work on to it now and they have lost loads too!

 

[ianf0ster]

Congratulations that you have a DN who is clued up enough to mention cutting carbs.

I will get criticised for saying this but, for certain (very few) people WW or SW can work though I think the success rate is below 2% and failure using them will inevitably make things worse.

Low Carb, either using Diabetes.co.uk 's own Low Carb program (available on NHS prescription), or www.DietDoctor 's one, or just do it yourself from free information and the Low Carb Forum here is a much better option to try (no downside if it doesn't work for you). The success rate varies depending upon the program , but it is from as low as 26% up to as high as 60%. Dr David Unwin's GP practice in Southport has a current success rate of 50% for Low Carb.

Since you are taking Insulin, if you try Low Carb you will need to take it slowly doing lots of testing and getting your dose adjusted so as to avoid a Hypo. But others have managed to do this by recording keeping track of Blood Glucose readings and gaining assistance from their Health Care Professional - even if that HCP was initially not supportive of Low Carb.

 

[Daibell]

Hi, as others have said neither, as these 'clubs' only make a profit when you remain a member so where is the incentive to get your weight down to a good range. They (some would say wrongly) focus on reducing calories rather than reducing carbs. Note that insulin only causes weight gain when you eat too many carbs. Insulin itself can't cause weight gain as it's a hormone but it can trigger the body to metabolise carbs more easily and the carbs are the main cause of weight gain. Yes, do consider carb-counting and seek your DN's advice if needed.