T2 Considerable weight loss 7kg / 1st in 3 months - HELP PLEASE!

[RobsterUK]

I'm 43, Diagnosed in July 2018 with T2 with HbA1c @ 103.... Started on Metformin change of diet cutting out chocolates, cakes, biscuits, full fat red coke 2L & anything for a sugar fix & substitute sweet things for meals but changed my lifestyle and eating habits & eating more healthy, even have something for breakfast now. I weighed 73kg 11 stone 5 - average build, slight mid age spread.

Returned in November 2018 for new blood tests, HbA1c was down to 75, cholesterol tested this time was 0.1 over the higher amount of 5, so showed as "Abnormal" so take 1x atorvastatin a day since mid December, I weighed 73kg again - continued with the 4x Metformin a day

Last week more blood tests HbA1c show 52 - GP considers stablised
Cholesterol is abnormal but now at the other end of the scale now 2.7 ,the lowest should be 3.0
Weight 66kg 10 Stone 4 a loss of 7-8kg / 1st 2 in 3 months

I have noticed the weight flying off me I've been just under 65kg / 10st 2 - but seem to stay around 66kg
My belt has several new holes, I have a constant thirst and dry mouth, pee 2-4 times during the night, can happily fall asleep for 2 hours in the evening, get blurred vision & ED - so basically all the symptoms of diabetes.
I'm drinking mineral water & 3-4 cups of coffee or tea a day

Been testing my blood sugars they usually between 8.5 - 12.2 couple of times 18.8 in last month. But lowest was 4 and highest was 22 - when I wake seems lower and an hour later usually 10+
GP says my blood sugars are stabalised at 52 and to keep taking the 4x daily Metformin and the weight loss is "probably" due to the change in diet as the body is going through changes without the constant influx of sugars

However last week sent me to get a chest x-ray, I stopped smoking 2 weeks ago

I just think my GP surgery is lousy and not listening to me or taking my symptoms for real

I.m really concerned about the weight loss, even my partner (has T1 for 23 years) has noticed I've lost loads of weight since December, she could see my ribs the other day when I was lying down..... & other friends say I could have T1

I've tried to research this weight loss, think I'm going to loose the plot soon if I don't find out what is wrong with me.

Does metformin cause weight loss like this?

Sugar levels half what they were 6 months ago, body is producing insulin.... so slim chance of being T1 but GP won't test for that!

Have all the symptoms......

Told not to test sugars 4x times a day and to only test 4x a week until I have ran out - Can't afford the GlucoRX test strips as GP said I have already had 150 test strips and sugars are fine. I want to monitor my sugars so looking at other machines to purchase with cheaper test strips as I know my sugars vary like everyone

Any thoughts on the weight loss? Or is the GP right? I don't feel right or well at all

 

[EllieM]

Sugar levels half what they were 6 months ago, body is producing insulin.... so slim chance of being T1 but GP won't test for that!

You're producing some insulin, maybe not enough. Your insulin needs have changed because of dietary change so I'm thinking that LADA could still be a possibility. Keep an eye on your ketones because if you eventually stop producing insulin then you are at risk for DKA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latent_autoimmune_diabetes_in_adults

It's good that you've stopped smoking - I'm guessing that the doctor may take your symptoms more seriously once he can't just tell you to stop smoking as a cure all. (And smoking is so much worse for diabetics, my T1 mother died from the smoking not the diabetes.)

Good luck.

 

[Tophat1900]

I agree with what has been posted above by @EllieM - it maybe that your have been wrongly diagnosed. I don't produce enough insulin, so I have to take it. I think you really need to get tested to see what type you are. Seems like a HBA1C result is all that was used for diagnosis.

BTW - Your sugar numbers are not fine based on those numbers and shooting up to double figures is never stable or a good thing.

 

[Prem51]

Welcome to the forum @RobsterUK. I agree you might well be Type 1 or LADA.
I wouldn't be concerned about the weight loss. I lost 1st 9lbs in first 3 months. You say you have given up sweet stuff and you are eating 'more healthy' now. What sort of food are you eating? The NHS diet advice isn't good for diabetics - particularly Type 2s.
The advice to continuing to eat carbohydrates and fruit, will raise our blood glucose. Starchy carbs like bread, potatoes, pasta and rice turns to glucose quickly in our bodies. Most fruit (except berries) contain fructose.

 

[jjraak]

Hi @RobsterUK .

i agree with @Tophat1900 ....those numbers do not look right..

"Been testing my blood sugars they usually between 8.5 - 12.2 couple of times 18.8 in last month. But lowest was 4 and highest was 22 - when I wake seems lower and an hour later usually 10+"

i fluctuate (Type 2 / diet N metformin) and i'd usually be near 5/6 and after foods around 7, maybe an 8 occasionally...but even in early days i'd always be under 10 mmol
i was horrified around xmas when i got naughty and ended up at 13..:***:

The weight loss, i got too and the new holes in belt.
but the Bg would be a concern for me, sorry..

@Prem spotted the newbie status, sorry mate..welcome,
and the advice re foods..spot on

perhaps you need to check out what others eat, maybe your choices are the issue here

on the meter front, i went code free, meter ok, strips reasonable, and voucher code to get discount available on here.

i'd be tempted, if your not going to finance the meter you have or get it funded by docs, to buy my own .
the code free has a little bit of a rep for being out..but i would want to know where my Bg was at any given time, and i think you NEED to know and find the pattern of food that's causing it,
or it's back to the doctors for more investigations, but at least then you'd be better armed.

And my 2 bits
who are they to tell us what we should do to protect OUR health.
i believe it should a right for any T2D to have a meter and strips, If they can prove to surgery they use it and use it sensibly.
THAT is cost effective management, not letting us get sicker and sicker, until we are costing more and more to look after..

Good Luck

 

[Tophat1900]

I don't understand why you have to endure a statin?

Neither do I...

 

[JoKalsbeek]

I'm 43, Diagnosed in July 2018 with T2 with HbA1c @ 103.... Started on Metformin change of diet cutting out chocolates, cakes, biscuits, full fat red coke 2L & anything for a sugar fix & substitute sweet things for meals but changed my lifestyle and eating habits & eating more healthy, even have something for breakfast now. I weighed 73kg 11 stone 5 - average build, slight mid age spread.

Returned in November 2018 for new blood tests, HbA1c was down to 75, cholesterol tested this time was 0.1 over the higher amount of 5, so showed as "Abnormal" so take 1x atorvastatin a day since mid December, I weighed 73kg again - continued with the 4x Metformin a day

Last week more blood tests HbA1c show 52 - GP considers stablised
Cholesterol is abnormal but now at the other end of the scale now 2.7 ,the lowest should be 3.0
Weight 66kg 10 Stone 4 a loss of 7-8kg / 1st 2 in 3 months

I have noticed the weight flying off me I've been just under 65kg / 10st 2 - but seem to stay around 66kg
My belt has several new holes, I have a constant thirst and dry mouth, pee 2-4 times during the night, can happily fall asleep for 2 hours in the evening, get blurred vision & ED - so basically all the symptoms of diabetes.
I'm drinking mineral water & 3-4 cups of coffee or tea a day

Been testing my blood sugars they usually between 8.5 - 12.2 couple of times 18.8 in last month. But lowest was 4 and highest was 22 - when I wake seems lower and an hour later usually 10+
GP says my blood sugars are stabalised at 52 and to keep taking the 4x daily Metformin and the weight loss is "probably" due to the change in diet as the body is going through changes without the constant influx of sugars

However last week sent me to get a chest x-ray, I stopped smoking 2 weeks ago

I just think my GP surgery is lousy and not listening to me or taking my symptoms for real

I.m really concerned about the weight loss, even my partner (has T1 for 23 years) has noticed I've lost loads of weight since December, she could see my ribs the other day when I was lying down..... & other friends say I could have T1

I've tried to research this weight loss, think I'm going to loose the plot soon if I don't find out what is wrong with me.

Does metformin cause weight loss like this?

Sugar levels half what they were 6 months ago, body is producing insulin.... so slim chance of being T1 but GP won't test for that!

Have all the symptoms......

Told not to test sugars 4x times a day and to only test 4x a week until I have ran out - Can't afford the GlucoRX test strips as GP said I have already had 150 test strips and sugars are fine. I want to monitor my sugars so looking at other machines to purchase with cheaper test strips as I know my sugars vary like everyone

Any thoughts on the weight loss? Or is the GP right? I don't feel right or well at all

Stable... Right. Not if your numbers are fluctuating like that. Please ask your GP for a referral, because he's obviously in over his head. You can lose weight, and lots of it, when you start low carbing. But that doesn't gel with the numbers you're seeing; those'd be low too. Get a C-Peptide and a GAD test done, check if the T2 diagnosis is correct. Because it doesn't exactly sound like it, not really... And you do want to get this looked after properly, fast.

Good luck!
Jo

 

[Member496333]

Your blood numbers have all the hallmarks of a treatment strategy comprising solely of drugs.

There’s nothing stable about swings from ~4 to ~20mmol/L. This is why HbA1c alone is a poor marker of metabolic health. It tells you nothing about hypoglycaemia or hyperglycaemia events. Much less blood insulin levels. It’s an average which cannot ever record toxic glucose concentrations or life threatening hypos. The fact that you have been told to stop testing yourself when your current batch of strips run out makes me angry.

Your doctor is misinformed and needs to refer you to someone who knows what they’re doing. Please take action if you are willing to do so. Your health is at risk. Those blood glucose concentrations are harmful.

 

[Tophat1900]

If you wish to educate yourself, you can learn a lot from this guy...www.thefatemperor.com/blog

Check out the videos section, you can learn a lot. He explains things so well. IMO - You will have at your finger tips a wealth of knowledge that you won't get from your gp.

www.dietdoctor.com is also great.

IMO- the best thing you can do is educate yourself (You'll learn a lot here on this forum also). It helps in so many ways to better understand what you are dealing with.

 

[Japes]

That sounds very similar to my experience, over three years, and little was, or could be, done until my Hba1c spiralled out of control, despite all my best efforts and maximum doses of Metformin and Gliclazide. I doubt Metformin had anything to do with my weight loss.

I had all the standard symptoms of T1 prior to my initial T2 diagnosis, had lost 4 stone before being taken seriously there, (I did have 8 stone to lose, so all most GPs and nurses concentrated on was the weight thing) then flew under the radar for two years once I'd got my Hba1c down to a steady mid-50s from mid 140s. Plus, one GP who told me in all seriousness T1 was for children only, not adults, and another one who bluntly told me at my weight what else could I expect. (This was after the initial loss, but prior to the next 4 stone going...) I left that practice. Then two more telling me I had to expect T2 to progress and I couldn't be doing enough with diet and exercise...

I was lucky enough eventually to get to a GP, the only one I will now see and not be fobbed off with the two others in the practice who only got for the T2 is progressive line, who listened to my repeated statements of "I'm losing weight without trying, I'm not eating ANY of the standard carbs, only a few raspberries for fruit, and walking 8 - 10 miles a day." and decided he would rather get told off for referring me to the clinic earlier than he was supposed to, after Metformin and Gliclazide were clearly not doing their jobs. He was meant to try a third line of oral medication. (Gliclazide having worked too well in the early stages, and I was taken off it after two weeks!)

Having self-funded for a meter and test strips, it was the best money I'd ever spent as I had clear evidence of how my blood sugars had deteriorated, along with a food diary, and details of any physical activity both for the excellent GP and the clinic. I also had a series of photos to demonstrate the weight loss which helped enormously as well.

I was lucky enough not to experience DKA though whether or not the months of running high enough to have an Hba1c in the mid-140s initially, and the creep back up to 110 the day I was put on insulin and LADA was diagnosed, will have an effect on my long term health remains to be seen. So far, so good on all usual checks.

 

[jjraak]

If you wish to educate yourself, you can learn a lot from this guy...www.thefatemperor.com]

Great link..cheers for posting

 

[Pinkorchid]

I think you should go back to the doctors ASAP because of your rapid weight loss and the way you feel it could well be that you are T1 or Lada so you may need insulin You need to get it sorted out with the GP which is all we can say as no one is medically qualified here

 

[Daibell]

I agree with previous posts. Yes, LADA remains a possibility. Push for the two tests and if the surgery refuses you can always have them done privately as I did when I gave up with my GP. Metformin does not directly cause weight loss. It does reduce appetite a bit which obviously helps a bit with weight loss. That cholesterol level is too low. You need to ignore the total figure and have a fasting lipids blood test and look at all the ratios. You may need to stop the statin for a short while before the test so it measures your natural levels. The body needs cholesterol and medics rush too fast to remove it from the body. As my diabetes GP said to me 15 years ago 'soon we will not have any fat left in our bodies' if NICE keeps taking the total target figure down.

 

[DCUKMod]

I'm 43, Diagnosed in July 2018 with T2 with HbA1c @ 103.... Started on Metformin change of diet cutting out chocolates, cakes, biscuits, full fat red coke 2L & anything for a sugar fix & substitute sweet things for meals but changed my lifestyle and eating habits & eating more healthy, even have something for breakfast now. I weighed 73kg 11 stone 5 - average build, slight mid age spread.

Returned in November 2018 for new blood tests, HbA1c was down to 75, cholesterol tested this time was 0.1 over the higher amount of 5, so showed as "Abnormal" so take 1x atorvastatin a day since mid December, I weighed 73kg again - continued with the 4x Metformin a day

Last week more blood tests HbA1c show 52 - GP considers stablised
Cholesterol is abnormal but now at the other end of the scale now 2.7 ,the lowest should be 3.0
Weight 66kg 10 Stone 4 a loss of 7-8kg / 1st 2 in 3 months

I have noticed the weight flying off me I've been just under 65kg / 10st 2 - but seem to stay around 66kg
My belt has several new holes, I have a constant thirst and dry mouth, pee 2-4 times during the night, can happily fall asleep for 2 hours in the evening, get blurred vision & ED - so basically all the symptoms of diabetes.
I'm drinking mineral water & 3-4 cups of coffee or tea a day

Been testing my blood sugars they usually between 8.5 - 12.2 couple of times 18.8 in last month. But lowest was 4 and highest was 22 - when I wake seems lower and an hour later usually 10+
GP says my blood sugars are stabalised at 52 and to keep taking the 4x daily Metformin and the weight loss is "probably" due to the change in diet as the body is going through changes without the constant influx of sugars

However last week sent me to get a chest x-ray, I stopped smoking 2 weeks ago

I just think my GP surgery is lousy and not listening to me or taking my symptoms for real

I.m really concerned about the weight loss, even my partner (has T1 for 23 years) has noticed I've lost loads of weight since December, she could see my ribs the other day when I was lying down..... & other friends say I could have T1

I've tried to research this weight loss, think I'm going to loose the plot soon if I don't find out what is wrong with me.

Does metformin cause weight loss like this?

Sugar levels half what they were 6 months ago, body is producing insulin.... so slim chance of being T1 but GP won't test for that!

Have all the symptoms......

Told not to test sugars 4x times a day and to only test 4x a week until I have ran out - Can't afford the GlucoRX test strips as GP said I have already had 150 test strips and sugars are fine. I want to monitor my sugars so looking at other machines to purchase with cheaper test strips as I know my sugars vary like everyone

Any thoughts on the weight loss? Or is the GP right? I don't feel right or well at all

Robster, there are so many things that can cause weightloss; some things like, "I'm not eating as much", or "I've gone off x, y, or z for a while" are usually easily fixed, through to some much more worrying reasons.

Starting with a few simple questions; Have you experienced any recent illness - maybe dose of the flu, upset tummy or the like? Have your diet or exercise levels changes at all in the recent past? Do you feel any different; maybe agitated or listless? How is your concentration? Have your bathroom habits changed at all?

We're not here as health care professionals to diagnose you , but were I in your shoes, if I didn't think my GP was taking my concerns seriously enough, I would seen another GP in the practise for a second opinion chat. Every patient is entitled to a second opinion.

What was the result of your chest x-ray? Do you have it back?

I would suggest your GP isn't dismissing your concerns, but is maybe considering a diabetes related issue less. Chest x-rays for a smoker, or very recent ex-smoker, are always a sensible precaution, I would guess.

Not everything is diabetes related, and our sugars can go wonky due to many things - diet, exercise, illness, stress, disrupted sleep, not to mention the weather, but it would seem sensible that you do continue testing whilst this mystery goes on.

Please don't think I am dismissing anything diabetes related. I'm just trying encourage you not to get too focussed on any one thing whist the mystery remains

Good luck with it all.

 

[SB.25]

Hi, I am currently going through a similar situation. Hba1c on diagnosis was 103. Was given metformin and lost 1 stone in 3 weeks (bmi was only 21 to begin with). Currently undergoing tests for T1 / T1.5 / MODY.

I have been on insulin since January 3rd whilst they try to work out what is going on. Since going on the insulin I have managed to put on 4lbs again.

I’m 3 months into the investigations and still no answer yet as to my type of diabetes which is frustrating. I hope you get an answer quicker than me!

 

[Resurgam]

Your numbers are high - I just did a random check on mine and it is 6.3. I take no medication as I eat low carb foods, mostly, and go by my weight rather than blood glucose, as that has been normal for ages now.
I think that your doctor is mistaken and that your numbers being as high as 22 mean that you need further investigation.

 

[alf_Josiah]

I'm not medically trained and therefore I cannot offer medical advice.
Now reading your post and nearly all of the replies. I think you have introduced a number of changes into the chemical factory that is your body.

Giving up smoking must have an effect. Cutting out the sugars also. Then the weight loss.
Your doctor has referred you for an x-ray, a good thing I think.

Perhaps if you start a food diary listing what you eat and the time also your fasting blood sugars that in a few weeks time might help both you and your doctor.

Statins- the medical profession seem to be fixated on getting the whole country on statins, but that is only my opinion.

Take care and I hope you soon start feel better.
Alf

 

[HSSS]

I'm 43, Diagnosed in July 2018 with T2 with HbA1c @ 103.... Started on Metformin change of diet cutting out chocolates, cakes, biscuits, full fat red coke 2L & anything for a sugar fix & substitute sweet things for meals but changed my lifestyle and eating habits & eating more healthy, even have something for breakfast now. I weighed 73kg 11 stone 5 - average build, slight mid age spread.

Returned in November 2018 for new blood tests, HbA1c was down to 75, cholesterol tested this time was 0.1 over the higher amount of 5, so showed as "Abnormal" so take 1x atorvastatin a day since mid December, I weighed 73kg again - continued with the 4x Metformin a day

Last week more blood tests HbA1c show 52 - GP considers stablised
Cholesterol is abnormal but now at the other end of the scale now 2.7 ,the lowest should be 3.0
Weight 66kg 10 Stone 4 a loss of 7-8kg / 1st 2 in 3 months

I have noticed the weight flying off me I've been just under 65kg / 10st 2 - but seem to stay around 66kg
My belt has several new holes, I have a constant thirst and dry mouth, pee 2-4 times during the night, can happily fall asleep for 2 hours in the evening, get blurred vision & ED - so basically all the symptoms of diabetes.
I'm drinking mineral water & 3-4 cups of coffee or tea a day

Been testing my blood sugars they usually between 8.5 - 12.2 couple of times 18.8 in last month. But lowest was 4 and highest was 22 - when I wake seems lower and an hour later usually 10+
GP says my blood sugars are stabalised at 52 and to keep taking the 4x daily Metformin and the weight loss is "probably" due to the change in diet as the body is going through changes without the constant influx of sugars

However last week sent me to get a chest x-ray, I stopped smoking 2 weeks ago

I just think my GP surgery is lousy and not listening to me or taking my symptoms for real

I.m really concerned about the weight loss, even my partner (has T1 for 23 years) has noticed I've lost loads of weight since December, she could see my ribs the other day when I was lying down..... & other friends say I could have T1

I've tried to research this weight loss, think I'm going to loose the plot soon if I don't find out what is wrong with me.

Does metformin cause weight loss like this?

Sugar levels half what they were 6 months ago, body is producing insulin.... so slim chance of being T1 but GP won't test for that!

Have all the symptoms......

Told not to test sugars 4x times a day and to only test 4x a week until I have ran out - Can't afford the GlucoRX test strips as GP said I have already had 150 test strips and sugars are fine. I want to monitor my sugars so looking at other machines to purchase with cheaper test strips as I know my sugars vary like everyone

Any thoughts on the weight loss? Or is the GP right? I don't feel right or well at all

You began with really quite a high hb1ac. However you made some positive changes and in approximately 4 months by taking metformin and changing diet you dropped those numbers. Personally I think the statins were an overreaction and would never have taken than. There are lots of threads in this forum about statins. Take a read and make your own mind up though. They do raise blood sugars amongst other side effects. It seems they are overdoing their job now. Ask about reducing or even better stopping them perhaps.

Has your diet improved since November? Are you eating carbs. The things you mentioned dropping previously were sugary things but you aren’t specific about the carb stuff like bread rice potato pasta etc. The change in diet could be the cause of weight loss and in fact dropping the sugars and possibly carbs too is likely to cause weight loss as you’ll be better able to process the glucose in your system by having less of it and thus not storing so much of it. Also calories are likely to be a fair bit lower too.

Are the symptoms, other than weight loss, you describe new? Or have they been there since before diagnosis. Falling numbers would usually mean fewer symptoms but that doesn’t appear to be the case for you.

When are you testing in relation to food? Immediately before and two hours after? Random tests don’t tell us so much and are difficult to pass judgement on. Ideally you want a rise of no more than 2mmol between those two readings. More than that means there were too many carbs for your body to process. So that means less carbs (or I guess you could choose more medications if you preferred). Double digit numbers aren’t something to be ignored, especially the 18’#.


We often wake with one number and find it rises. It could be the breakfast you eat but even without food there’s something called dawn phenomenon where your liver shoots out glucose to”help” you get up and going. In diabetics we often don’t deal with this normal event well and it goes up higher than needed for a while.


I’d be getting a monitor and strips self funded to keep an eye on what foods are doing to you by testing some meals as described above. I’d be going back to see the gp or diabetic nurse expressing concern over my symptoms of thirst and peeing and the high numbers if you can’t make sense of them in relation to food and don’t get an improvement by altering the meals to keep the numbers down.

 

[RobsterUK]

Thanks everyone for commenting & the feedback, I’ve lost the weight & haven’t tried nor needed to lose any, not at 73kg now down to 65kg in a short time.
I have virtually 0 sugar intake & watch what I eat, just purchased a new tester & strips as I can’t fund the strips & tester I have by using. Despite my concerns & symptoms my blood sugars this last week are between 9 - 18.8 & despite being told to test 4 times a week until I run out, would rather spend a few quid & monitor by sugar levels as I know they fluctuate so much.
Seeing a specialist diabetic GP on Thursday where I’m going to raise my concerns & ask for T1 T1.5 & LADA, GAD & C-Peptide tests to be done, I will even pay for them if necessary as need to find out what’s wrong, sooner than later

I will update when I know more - thanks again for your support, has been a help

 

[Tophat1900]

Good luck. Hope it all goes well.